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Old 10-23-2007, 01:21 PM   #1 (permalink)
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5.0 HO EFI to Carb

I am not sure if it is possible but I would like to put a carb intake on an 89 5.0 HO. If it is possible what would be a good choice, not looking for anything extreme. Just for a daily driver with a little kick. Since the engine would be going in a 65 Stang could I bolt a C-4 up to it.
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Old 10-23-2007, 02:25 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Re: 5.0 HO EFI to Carb

All 302/5.0 intake manifolds are interchangeable with any year 302/5.0. A Weiand stealth dual plane intake would work great on there with your choice of carb. The C4 will bolt up but keep in mind that a '68 302 has a 28oz imbalance on the dampner and flexplate, whereas an '89 302 has a 50oz imbalance. Use a 50oz flexplate for a C4 and you are good to go, Summit probably sells them.
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Old 10-23-2007, 06:20 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Re: 5.0 HO EFI to Carb

I did that swap for my 68 about 2 years ago with EFI 5.0 (not H.O but same deal...)
Here is what youll need + few tips:

1. Intake and carb, you can go any where between 500CFM to 650CFM agood idia will be some where in the middle = 600CFM. 500 will be beter for economy

2. you will have to use a 65 oil pan cause the 87-93 were using the duble sump pans and they will not fit cause of the steering parts in your 65.
A good idia if you are alredy opening the pan will be to change the oil pump and have a highe vol' oil pump, it is not expensive (about 70$) and can give your engine a few more years.

3. As james302 wrote, you will have to to change your flex plate to 50 oz.

4. Fuel pump - the 5.0 EFI had a high presure electric fuel pump that will not work with carb, you can buy an electric pump that will work with carbureted engines like the "holley blue" but they are noisy as hall and they will boil your fuel, and if you want to go daily they are not recomended without a bypass and returne line the other option is to change the original timing cover from the EFI engine that had the mechanical fuel pump hole pluged, to a 302 timing cover with the hole for the mechanical fuel pump open (cost about 60$) and install a bullet proof mechanical fuel pump.
You mentioned you are a daily driver, well, me too and the one thing I can tell you I did wrong in the swap is that, I though ..."lets not chnge the timing cover, it is too much work, I'll buy a good electric one, it is more simple"... after starting the engine with the electric pump I wanted to hang myself! the most anoing noise in the world! plus, even if you will buy a quiet pump, they will boill the fuel and themselves and will die fast, I had the holley black that died after 2 moth of daily driving in heavy traffic, I had the holley blue ( yes it was installed by the manual and had good gravity fed) 6 month in the same conditions and it died too, I called holley customer service and quality controll and they shipped me one on there expense, but they said they never ment for a daily "continues use" I have friends using it on the weekend on open rods, that is ok but for the daily, **IT WILL BE WORTH THE EFFORT TO GO WITH MECHNICL** after all that I convert to mechanicle pump and I can't understand how I didnt do it from the begining...
If you will go with mechanicl, it will be a good idia to change a timing chain, you are alredy taking the cover of so you dont have to pay for labor, only 60-80$ more for a good duble roller chaine that will be good for alot of miles...
*you will have to install a pump ECCENTRIC to drive the pump (20$)

5. Pulley - I bought a set of "March performance" serpentine Pulley, I have a friend that succeed to use the 87 pulley on his 65 stang (see the pic, I'll try to get a better one tomorrow ) or you can use the stock 65 so it is realy up to you and your funding...

6. water pump- you need to know 87-93 5.0 had a counter clockwise water pump rotation so if you will use the original 65 pulley, the rotation will be wrong, change the pump or the pulley.

7. The H.O was originally equipping with headers, dont suffocate it with old 289 exhost manifold.

8. The tiny radiator of the 65 will not be sufficient to the H.O, you will have to buy aluminum or abiger radiator (cut the radiator support to fit a biger radiator...

9. Distributor - and for a daily driver you should use a highe energy like the MSD for better starting, beter economy and beter power.
Attached Thumbnails
5.0 HO EFI to Carb-efi-carb1.jpg   5.0 HO EFI to Carb-efi-carb3.jpg   5.0 HO EFI to Carb-efi-carb4.jpg  

5.0 HO EFI to Carb-efi-carb2.jpg  
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Old 10-24-2007, 10:15 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Re: 5.0 HO EFI to Carb

No offense but why? You will lose gas mileage ($3.00/gal!) and drivability and probably some torque. EFI can be modified easily for more HP too and its cleaner. Plus you can not pass an emissions test.
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Old 10-24-2007, 02:33 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Re: 5.0 HO EFI to Carb

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldtim View Post
No offense but why? You will lose gas mileage ($3.00/gal!) and drivability and probably some torque. EFI can be modified easily for more HP too and its cleaner. Plus you can not pass an emissions test.
Good point. If you have access to the wiring harness and ECU then why not stick with it?? Otherwise Im sure you could track down a harness and comp for pretty cheap maybe less that a intake/carb combo.
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Old 10-25-2007, 05:18 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Re: 5.0 HO EFI to Carb

With A well tuned carburator you can pass an emissions test as you can see in page 3 of this article http://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/2...etor/index.php

In my opinion, carburated engines are more simple to work with and it is cheaper to install then EFI (on your 65) and cheaper to maintain, but this is only me...
If you like the EFI idia, you can use this nice article Mustangs Plus - EFI Conversion Page 1 they explaining realy good how to convert carburated 66 cope to EFI, and they also carry all the parts you'll need for the convertion, you can find it in this link Mustangs Plus*::*EFI & T-5 Conversions they have a nice friendly service.
Good Luck
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Old 10-27-2007, 05:21 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Re: 5.0 HO EFI to Carb

I did a swap with an '89 HO motor in my '68 a while back. You do have to tap the block on the driver's side w/ a 1/4" plug where the dipsick goes because you want the dipstick for a front sump pan. The timing cover for the HO can be drilled for the new dipstick location if you go with an electric pump instead of using an older one setup for mechanical that already has a dipstick hole. I used a Carter which was very quiet and you could hardly hear it and only if you listened for it over the exhaust. The other fuel pumps are loud and you can go mechanical, but I really liked that Carter. The cam that came with that motor was pretty decent too and I wouldn't change that because it works well with either fuel injection or a carb.

http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku
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Old 10-27-2007, 08:26 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Re: 5.0 HO EFI to Carb

I have a carbed 89 motor in my Maverick. EFI is nice, when it works. If something goes wrong with my carb I can fix it with a screwdriver.
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Old 10-27-2007, 11:13 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Re: 5.0 HO EFI to Carb

Quote:
Originally Posted by bmcd66250 View Post
I have a carbed 89 motor in my Maverick. EFI is nice, when it works. If something goes wrong with my carb I can fix it with a screwdriver.
This is very true. EFI is very hard to compare to for on the street daily driving. I've been pondering over the EFI verses Carb issue for quiet a while now, and what I've come to realize is, that most of the original equipment stuff on the cars is going to be 15 to 20 years old as is. So I ask myself, just how reliable will it be with the old sensors and brittle wires. I've priced some after market conversions, but for now it just isn't in my bank account.
EFI would be an ideal way to go if not for the cost factors.
Lack of knowledge is another barrier I face.
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Old 04-18-2009, 12:49 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Re: 5.0 HO EFI to Carb

Good stuff guys!

I recently put an 89 EFI 5.0 in my ranger. Its got a cam, its been bored, and it screams. The conversion was a bit of a pain, but after a month of weekends, I got it running. The EFI has NEVER run right. I replaced injectors, copied wiring harnesses, redid vacuum lines, and so on. The engine surges between 1300 rpm and 500 rpm. It used to only happen in gear while stopped at a light, but now it does it all of the time. Ive replaced just about everything short of the ECU...

I'm a computer genious, but I finally gave into this one. Got a nice f28 intake with 2 500cfm carter afb carbs. I know its a bit much carb for the engine, but I figure that progressive linkage will be great for it!

EFI is awesome....when it works. I'm going back to carb for a few reasons...

1. I know how to fix em
2. Lets face it, EFI is ugly! 2 quads look sooooooo much sexier!
3. My EFI is screwed (i think)
4. I cant stand the low gas milage. I know for a fact I can pull atleast 18 out of that 302 with those carbs, i've done it before
5. Unless you have one of those crazy matchbox ricer cars, you dont need a computer to controll your engine when a carb and MSD do amazing things. I cant imagine that much of a power loss with my setup.

those are my thoughts....
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Old 04-18-2009, 06:36 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Re: 5.0 HO EFI to Carb

I read somewhere, and correct me if Im wrong, that a high vol oil pump is not recomended in small block fords. Something about starving the oil flow to certain other parts of the engine?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MusclePoney View Post
I did that swap for my 68 about 2 years ago with EFI 5.0 (not H.O but same deal...)
Here is what youll need + few tips:

1. Intake and carb, you can go any where between 500CFM to 650CFM agood idia will be some where in the middle = 600CFM. 500 will be beter for economy

2. you will have to use a 65 oil pan cause the 87-93 were using the duble sump pans and they will not fit cause of the steering parts in your 65.
A good idia if you are alredy opening the pan will be to change the oil pump and have a highe vol' oil pump, it is not expensive (about 70$) and can give your engine a few more years.

3. As james302 wrote, you will have to to change your flex plate to 50 oz.

4. Fuel pump - the 5.0 EFI had a high presure electric fuel pump that will not work with carb, you can buy an electric pump that will work with carbureted engines like the "holley blue" but they are noisy as hall and they will boil your fuel, and if you want to go daily they are not recomended without a bypass and returne line the other option is to change the original timing cover from the EFI engine that had the mechanical fuel pump hole pluged, to a 302 timing cover with the hole for the mechanical fuel pump open (cost about 60$) and install a bullet proof mechanical fuel pump.
You mentioned you are a daily driver, well, me too and the one thing I can tell you I did wrong in the swap is that, I though ..."lets not chnge the timing cover, it is too much work, I'll buy a good electric one, it is more simple"... after starting the engine with the electric pump I wanted to hang myself! the most anoing noise in the world! plus, even if you will buy a quiet pump, they will boill the fuel and themselves and will die fast, I had the holley black that died after 2 moth of daily driving in heavy traffic, I had the holley blue ( yes it was installed by the manual and had good gravity fed) 6 month in the same conditions and it died too, I called holley customer service and quality controll and they shipped me one on there expense, but they said they never ment for a daily "continues use" I have friends using it on the weekend on open rods, that is ok but for the daily, **IT WILL BE WORTH THE EFFORT TO GO WITH MECHNICL** after all that I convert to mechanicle pump and I can't understand how I didnt do it from the begining...
If you will go with mechanicl, it will be a good idia to change a timing chain, you are alredy taking the cover of so you dont have to pay for labor, only 60-80$ more for a good duble roller chaine that will be good for alot of miles...
*you will have to install a pump ECCENTRIC to drive the pump (20$)

5. Pulley - I bought a set of "March performance" serpentine Pulley, I have a friend that succeed to use the 87 pulley on his 65 stang (see the pic, I'll try to get a better one tomorrow ) or you can use the stock 65 so it is realy up to you and your funding...

6. water pump- you need to know 87-93 5.0 had a counter clockwise water pump rotation so if you will use the original 65 pulley, the rotation will be wrong, change the pump or the pulley.

7. The H.O was originally equipping with headers, dont suffocate it with old 289 exhost manifold.

8. The tiny radiator of the 65 will not be sufficient to the H.O, you will have to buy aluminum or abiger radiator (cut the radiator support to fit a biger radiator...

9. Distributor - and for a daily driver you should use a highe energy like the MSD for better starting, beter economy and beter power.
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Old 04-19-2009, 06:25 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Re: 5.0 HO EFI to Carb

We did this exact carb conversion to my 86 mustang. We used a holley blue fuel pump, holley pressure regulator, (since it was efi alreadu we ripped out the computor and all the wiring) and im running a victor jr with an 825 mighty demon carb. the conversion is pretty simple, but since we had to run lines and drill the tank and mount everything, it was time consuming. I like it much better than EFI because you dont have to be a freggin electrician to stay on top of stuff lol. And problems are very simple and easy to fix. Tunability is far superior to that of an EFI motor, and alot of wngine builders say that you actually get better milage with a 600cfm 4150 with a performer rmp intake and a b303 than you do with a fuelie setup with the same mods. I belive it. But I cant really test with my 347 and 825cfm whopper lol
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Old 04-19-2009, 08:34 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Re: 5.0 HO EFI to Carb

Quote:
Originally Posted by colkerr View Post
I read somewhere, and correct me if Im wrong, that a high vol oil pump is not recomended in small block fords ...
I was going to mention the same thing. Overall, the list looks good, but unless you have a situation where you need the extra volume - and the engine is built for it - stick with the standard pump. The most common problem is shearing or twisting the pump drive shaft on a cold engine or at high rev's. Also, if your engine doesn't need it you're just wasting HP pumping past the bypass and back into the pan. If you have an engine that requires it, then you should at least be running an aftermarket hardened shaft.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hager View Post
... Tunability is far superior to that of an EFI motor, and alot of wngine builders say that you actually get better milage with a 600cfm 4150 with a performer rmp intake and a b303 than you do with a fuelie setup with the same mods. ...
Ah, a masochist. I'm sure you're not trying to start an off-topic flame war here, so let me head that off and just say that either carbs or EFI may work to give good power, mileage, and reliability at similar cost if applied properly in this application.

I would never force a particular system on a person who isn't either knowledgeable or willing to learn about it. I certainly believe builders should use what they're comfortable with, as they will likely apply it better, and therefore achieve better results with it. By the same token, I would not support one system by suggesting another system is not as good for a particular application if I'm not knowledgeable about it, or know how to apply it as well.

David
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Old 07-05-2009, 02:59 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Re: 5.0 HO EFI to Carb

Quote:
Originally Posted by colkerr View Post
I read somewhere, and correct me if Im wrong, that a high vol oil pump is not recomended in small block fords. Something about starving the oil flow to certain other parts of the engine?

I have had a few problems with that exact thing. The main problem that ive had is that at high RPMs, all of the oil ends up above my heads in my valve covers. Big problem for all of those cam and main bearings...
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