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Old 01-03-2008, 08:46 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Height of weiand SBF tunnel ram lower

I've got an idea brewing for a 'hybrid' tunnel ram/sheetmetal intake... basically pick up a Weiand (or Offy?) tunnel ram lower intake used for cheap, cut down the ports a little in the middle (v-shaped plenum floor, to take some height out of it), and build a low profile sheet-metal-type top for a single quad. Kinda want the tunnel ram/sheetmetla intake look/power without all the height and plenum volume of the standard single quad upper manifold, or the labor and cost of a full sheetmetal intake.

So anyways, does anyone know the height of JUST the lower half of the sbf tunnel ram intakes?
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Old 01-03-2008, 09:01 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Re: Height of weiand SBF tunnel ram lower

Dont waste your time or your money. The single four barrel top never works right on a tunnelram. When I was at Edelbrock, the single top would LOOSE 100 HP to the dual four barrel version.

JOE SHERMAN RACING ENGINES
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Old 01-03-2008, 09:07 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Re: Height of weiand SBF tunnel ram lower

I didn't know you were ever at Edlebrock, that must've been interesting! Why does the single top give up so much? Seems like you couldn't loose 100hp from just fuel distribution... is it really that much more restrictive? I thought this would work well since you see a LOT of high dollar engines with single four sheet metal (welded aluminum) intakes that really resemble a tunnel ram from the carb down?
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Old 02-07-2008, 03:53 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Re: Height of weiand SBF tunnel ram lower

Hi Joe I was searching online and stumbled on the following post by you on another forum:
------------------------
When I was at Edelbrock, They made the single top for some reason ( who knows ) but in stock form, It LOST 100 HP to the dual top. I cut about two ibches out of the lid near the bottom and rewelded it together. This change alone picked up 90 plus HP it had been loosing. Edelbrock never redesigned the single four barrel top. OH well.
------------------------

So by the sounds of it you were able to get most of the 100hp back by simply taking most of the plenum volume out of the upper intake? That's kinda what my idea was to do, except I thought I'd just start from scratch with a sheet metal upper rather than cutting on the original one (which I may not even get depending on what I buy). Do you think that would perform better than my current smaller single-plane? How do you think it would compare to a Victor Jr.?
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Old 02-07-2008, 10:04 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Re: Height of weiand SBF tunnel ram lower

I have not been to an NHRA race lately, but Comp Eliminator used single tunnel rams. They were not cut up cast stuff though. I would not think you would do yourself any favors by cutting up your intake.
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Old 02-08-2008, 10:18 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Re: Height of weiand SBF tunnel ram lower

Quote:
Originally Posted by brianj5600 View Post
I have not been to an NHRA race lately, but Comp Eliminator used single tunnel rams. They were not cut up cast stuff though. I would not think you would do yourself any favors by cutting up your intake.
I would be doing myself a favor by taking an inch or two out of the height of the standard single carb top for much more hood clearance. Plus decreasing plenum volume should make it a little more street friendly by optimizing it for a smaller cube engine. Keep in mind that these off-the-shelf cast upper manifolds are a one-fits-all type deal... the same upper manifold goes on both a Chevy 350 lower as a Ford 302/289 lower manifold (someone correct me if I'm wrong)... do you think they optimized the plenum volume for the Chevy 350 or the Ford 289? That should be an easy answer.

And as BigJoe said, with his own experience with a particular TR (don't know which one), taking 2" out of the plenum gained 90(!) hp, so obviously the R&D teams don't put as much thought into some of the designs as they should. If you look at a single carb TR top, and compare it to high-dollar, sheet-metal intakes that have a lot of research behind them, it's obvious they just took the dual-carb top and put a single carb pad on it, and didn't bother checking to see if there was a better way to do it.
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Old 02-08-2008, 10:43 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Re: Height of weiand SBF tunnel ram lower

I will be in the garage tomorrow and can measure my Weiand for you then. Which measurement do you want?

As I recall, the single 4v upper is only 2" or 3" thick from lower mounting to carb pad.

The listed dimensions from Weiand are
Height: Front 8.81", Rear 9.25"
Port Size: 1.85 height 1.02" width
But I believe this is with the upper attached.

This is what we did to mine to facilitate mounting the Enderle. We actually increased the size of the upper plenum, but being injected at the ports also means there is no fuel in the plenum at all.



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Old 02-08-2008, 01:57 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Re: Height of weiand SBF tunnel ram lower

Thanks Murff, I've seen your pics a few times and it never clicked in my head that it was a SBF tunnel ram, lol! I'm interested in the height from the base to the top of the lower manifold (where the plenum bolts on).

I've seen the published dimentions, and by just eyeballing it I figured the plenum was about 2.5-3.5" to the carb pad, so if I could cut down the middle divider of the runners (about 1/2"-1" out of the middle, same height on the sides, effectively take only about 1/4-1/2" out of the runner length) and make the upper a sort of pyramid to the carb pad with about 1.5-2" of height, I think I could shrink it quite a bit without giving up any performance (and hopefully gaining some streetability vs. the normal upper).

I think with your injection system, where you don't have to worry about maintaining a good signal to the carb, the big plenum you made is probably ideal. I'd love to do a similar setup, just don't have the cashola for something like that right now.

Edit: if you could also get the dimensions of the mating surface at the top of the lower intake (just the rough overall width and depth of the cluster of ports, and overall length across the top) I'd appreciate it. They don't have to be precise, just wondering about some ballpark figures.
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Last edited by Motorhead; 02-08-2008 at 02:19 PM.
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Old 02-11-2008, 06:19 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Re: Height of weiand SBF tunnel ram lower

Ok, it took longer than expected but I have some numbers for you.

The height at the rear is 5 15/16", height at the front is 5 7/8". Not much difference in the base from front to rear. I guess the rake is accomplished with the upper portion.

Front to back on the lower, where the upper mounts, is 13 7/8". There's only about 1 1/4" of depth in the runners before they begin to radius towards the ports. At best you may be able to take 1/2 of that away and still have enough material to bolt an upper to.

I would have had this for you Saturday, but best laid plans sometimes get screwed up. About 2" into welding on the firewall Saturday and the trigger switch on the Lincoln MIG went fubar. Probably a $2.00 part, but you know no one had one on a Saturday afternoon.

So it was out of the garage and off to look at trailers for the rest of the day and then Sunday at the swap meet and then home to the couch for a well deserved nap.

I need to add that there's a very good chance we will not be using this intake base again on the new setup. I'm not convinced this intake hasn't been cut before (had a few sealing issues, air only), and I am changing my adapter plates out for a set that have already been drilled and tapped for injection. The 'new' plates came off of a 408W that was in a nostalgia fuel dragster. Also, this intake has holes at the base of the runners where I had my injectors and I dont feel like welding them closed.

I guess what I'm saying is that if you decide to go forward with your idea and are going to be looking for an intake to thrash on, I'd probably make you a screamin' deal on this one as soon as I buy my new one.

Food for thought.
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Old 02-12-2008, 11:25 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Re: Height of weiand SBF tunnel ram lower

Thanks Murff, that's the info I was really looking for to get an idea of how tall my setup would be overall, and allow me to make some preliminary CAD drawings just to see how it will shape up. I always assumed some hood cutting would have to be involved, but now I know that I can probably get away with a relatively short scoop. Lately I've been partial to the thuderbolt/teardrop scoops, just not sure how one would look on a Ranger lol.

I think your intake would be a GREAT candidate for this project. I'd probably just plug the injector holes, just in case I decided to try out injection or, god forbid, nitrous in the future . Shoot me a PM when you get your new intake and we can work out the details.
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