NEEDED: AODE / 4R70W electronic info (transmission) - Ford Muscle Forums : Ford Muscle Cars Tech Forum
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post #1 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-06-2013, 11:41 AM Thread Starter
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NEEDED: AODE / 4R70W electronic info (transmission)

Many of us are - or are wanting to - retrofit the 4R70W/4R75W electronic-control transmissions (and other Fod trannys) to an older chassis providing substantially greater strength, more speeds, lower gear ratios, overdrive, and lockup converter, all on-demand.

If going carbureted, stand-alone trans controllers are out there from $700-1200 for the controller and with many the wiring harness is extra. Yikes! I'm working on an alternative using an MS GPIO board that has been used for other electronic transmissions. It's an assembly kit that you solder-up for less than half the cheapest option out there, including the case and harness (less trans-end connector). I would like to make this an option (along with pre-assembled units) for us Ford muscle folks, and I can start it with a project I have right now.

HELP: To do it, I need some info though. I am missing specific info for:
  1. The pulse width modulation (PWM) frequency AND duty cycle range of the EPC (Electronic Pressure Control) solenoid.
  2. Same info for the TCC (Torque Converter Control).
  3. Transfer function outline for EPC PWM.
I think I have most of the other info I'll need. Some of the info appears to have changed in different years as well. If anyone has or can get this info, I can move this along quickly. I would like to get the first unit together for initial programming in the next 30-45 days if possible. I need 4R70W info first (pre and post '98), and then other types (AODE, 4R75W/E, E4OD, 4R100, 5R55, etc.) will be relatively easy to program from there for other folks.

Thanks!
David

PS: Other optional features would come along with it, such as full shifter control, or paddle shifters on the steering wheel, LED gear indicators, one-button to switch shift firmness from Marshmallow to Madness, and more.

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post #2 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-06-2013, 12:54 PM
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Re: NEEDED: AODE / 4R70W electronic info (transmission)

David,
I can't help but do have a couple questions, do you intend to build and sell these control units once you have the information you need?

I'm very interested. I've read the article by Iwantmore several times.
Of the overdrives, which one would be best suited for moderate towing?
Towing example; an old pickup powered by a 351W pulling a 16'-0" trailer and 2700 lb racecar 30-60 miles each way, once a week. It currently has a C6 and 3.25 final ratio.


Thanks and sorry for the thread jack,
Gregg
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post #3 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-06-2013, 01:14 PM Thread Starter
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Re: NEEDED: AODE / 4R70W electronic info (transmission)

Hey Gregg - no, I am doing the set-up work and creating a working unit, then I will outline how others can do it themselves. If there are some that want a turn-key, assembled, tested and programmed unit, then I know a couple guys that do that sort of work for a reasonable fee (of course). In that case, it would be like the commercial ones - ready to install and select your own shift points for your use and shift firmness, etc. But first, I have to proof one out, and I'm ready with the trans but need the picky info to tell the black box what to do.

For your purposes, any of the later electronic transmissions (4R70W, E4OD, 4R100, etc.) with the SBF bell pattern would do fine, holding 500-1000hp with proper setup. Being an older truck with a mechanical speedometer, a pre-'99 trans with speedo drive would be simplest to drop in. The later ones are electronic speedo.

David

[EDIT] By-the-way, with the 3.25:1 rear gear you have now, and the gearing in most of those trannys, your first gear would be like a 3.72:1 rear gear, and your OD cruise would be equivalent to a 2.28:1 gear.

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Last edited by PSIG; 02-06-2013 at 01:23 PM.
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post #4 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-06-2013, 01:30 PM
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Re: NEEDED: AODE / 4R70W electronic info (transmission)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PSIG View Post
using an MS GPIO board that has been used for other electronic transmissions. It's an assembly kit that you solder-up for less than half the cheapest option out there, including the case and harness (less trans-end connector). I would like to make this an option (along with pre-assembled units) for us Ford muscle folks, and I can start it with a project I have right now.

HELP: To do it, I need some info though. I am missing specific info for:
  1. The pulse width modulation (PWM) frequency AND duty cycle range of the EPC (Electronic Pressure Control) solenoid.
  2. Same info for the TCC (Torque Converter Control).
  3. Transfer function outline for EPC PWM.


Is there no way to test a factory controller (via a scope) to get the needed parameters? Just a thought is all, cause all this electronic control sensor stuf is WAYYY over my head. I have zero experience messing with any kind of computer engine/trans control. Its all voodoo blackmagic to me.... I have a heard enough problem dealing with electronic ignition systems/boxes or conversions...

Quote:

PS: Other optional features would come along with it, such as full shifter control, or paddle shifters on the steering wheel, LED gear indicators, one-button to switch shift firmness from Marshmallow to Madness, and more.

I am so far behind the times I am in the "cavemen can do it crowd"

Cheap, Fast, Reliable... Pick 2...
'70 Mach1 351C 4v 4sp 4:56's Been abused sense '79, needing tlc
'61 Fairlane 500 292 2v Cruise-o-Matic also needing tlc
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post #5 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-06-2013, 02:17 PM Thread Starter
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Re: NEEDED: AODE / 4R70W electronic info (transmission)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mroldfart2U View Post
Is there no way to test a factory controller (via a scope) to get the needed parameters?
YES. I don't have a factory setup to test, but I'm hoping someone out there does (and can), or has a reference for the info.

David

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post #6 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-06-2013, 05:56 PM
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Re: NEEDED: AODE / 4R70W electronic info (transmission)

Would that info be in the Ford Shop service manual? May be a source for you.

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post #7 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-09-2013, 12:16 AM
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Re: NEEDED: AODE / 4R70W electronic info (transmission)

Hi David!
I found some info here TCCoA Transmission Article - Page 15 (half way down the page) . Cant say I really understand the info but maybe you do
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post #8 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-09-2013, 12:27 AM Thread Starter
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Re: NEEDED: AODE / 4R70W electronic info (transmission)

Quote:
Originally Posted by retyler View Post
Would that info be in the Ford Shop service manual? May be a source for you.
I asked a buddy with one and he said it only referred to using the Rotunda testing equipment. No specs. Yeah, so simple yet hard to find.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ALLIANderS View Post
Hi David!
I found some info here TCCoA Transmission Article - Page 15 (half way down the page) . Cant say I really understand the info but maybe you do
Apparently this guy knows the answer, but I have yet to be able to contact him. Keep throwing it at me. I haven't looked under the right rock yet. When I find it, the spec will be a frequency of XXX Hz or Hertz, or X KHz (KiloHertz), and the duty cycle will be a percent %. Good find (that TCCOA article is awesome)! Keep looking, and thanks!

David

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post #9 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-12-2013, 05:38 PM
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Re: NEEDED: AODE / 4R70W electronic info (transmission)

I'm installing a 4r70w in my 67 fastback and will be using the USshift quick 1. $565.00 delivered.


1965 Mustang Fastback 331, T5, 9" 3.50
1967 Mustang Fastback 331, T5, 8" 3.80
1967 Mustang Fastback A code GT 350
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post #10 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-12-2013, 06:02 PM Thread Starter
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Re: NEEDED: AODE / 4R70W electronic info (transmission)

While that's almost double the cost of what I'm doing, it's nice to see Baumann coming down in price for a good basic controller that's fully assembled and ready to go. I guess they have to, with at least two (that I know of) new controllers coming on the market in the next year at lower cost with more goodies. BTW - Direct, it's $585 for the 4R70W version and harness, plus shipping. Where did you get your better price?

David

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post #11 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-12-2013, 06:04 PM Thread Starter
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Re: NEEDED: AODE / 4R70W electronic info (transmission)

Anybody have an ATSG manual for the AODE and newer (updated)? I went to order one and they are back-ordered indefinitely.

David

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post #12 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-12-2013, 07:05 PM
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Re: NEEDED: AODE / 4R70W electronic info (transmission)

I bought mine last summer and they did $75 off sale for a while. I bought it when I did because of the sale price. Nice people to deal with.


1965 Mustang Fastback 331, T5, 9" 3.50
1967 Mustang Fastback 331, T5, 8" 3.80
1967 Mustang Fastback A code GT 350
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post #13 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-05-2014, 05:08 AM
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Re: NEEDED: AODE / 4R70W electronic info (transmission)

PSIG
How are you doing with your controller?
I do have a ATSG book, AODE\4R70w
if you still need info
Best
Dave
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post #14 of 21 (permalink) Old 02-05-2014, 06:18 AM Thread Starter
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Re: NEEDED: AODE / 4R70W electronic info (transmission)

Dave, the controller has moved to the back burner for lack of the info I need. It will come back to life this spring and summer though. While I can certainly assemble a unit and just do testing until it works properly, that takes a lot of time that I couldn't afford to finish other stuff.

The project is still going to be done, but I either need the info listed at the top, or the time to experiment to find the right values. Do your references list any of the info posted in Post #1?

David

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post #15 of 21 (permalink) Old 07-12-2014, 02:08 PM
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Re: NEEDED: AODE / 4R70W electronic info (transmission)

Resurrecting an old thread here but David have you seen this?

4r70w ford transmission controller. 20x2

He built his own controller from the ground up so he may know the specs you are looking for.

Last edited by Exothermia; 07-12-2014 at 07:23 PM.
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