393 stroker rwhp - Ford Muscle Forums : Ford Muscle Cars Tech Forum
FordMuscleForums.com is the premier Ford Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 06-07-2010, 03:01 PM   #1 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 100
393 stroker rwhp

Anybody have a 393windsor with 58cc AFR 205's, Comp xr292r cam, Super Victor intake, 11:1 CR, c4 trans with 2700 stall, 378 gears? What did you dyno at? rwhp
My builder says 480-500rwhp
Comp cam is 258, 260@50 duration, 621,627 lift solid street roller. Motor is all forged steel.

steve
Goneinsixty is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 06-07-2010, 03:28 PM   #2 (permalink)
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Savannah, GA
Posts: 888
Re: 393 stroker rwhp

Quote:
Originally Posted by Goneinsixty View Post
Anybody have a 393windsor with 58cc AFR 205's, Comp xr292r cam, Super Victor intake, 11:1 CR, c4 trans with 2700 stall, 378 gears? What did you dyno at? rwhp
My builder says 480-500rwhp
Comp cam is 258, 260@50 duration, 621,627 lift solid street roller. Motor is all forged steel.

steve
It sounds like that combination may have the potential for that kind of RWHP. However, my experience has been that most guys don't make as much power at the wheels as they think because there are a lot of other factors besides the engine's HP that can affect how much actually gets to the tires.
You will find that the prevailing wisdom on this site is to use a dyno as a tool to tune and make improvements, but let the track tell you how much power you really have.
__________________
'67 Mustang coupe
New Dart 427 under construction: AFR 205's-Ported Victor Jr.-Mighty Demon 825-Cam TBD-Miller rockers-Hooker Super Comps-3" exhaust-AOD w/non lock-up 3000 stall-3.55 Posi-4wheel disc brakes

Last edited by kgordonl; 06-07-2010 at 07:31 PM.
kgordonl is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-07-2010, 04:16 PM   #3 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 991
Re: 393 stroker rwhp

Aint making a legit 600 at the crank
__________________
FordStrokers.com : Owner
SBFTech.com : Owner
Quickly Becoming The Largest CHP/Probe Dealer
woody1 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-08-2010, 12:06 AM   #4 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 100
Re: 393 stroker rwhp

Quote:
Originally Posted by woody1 View Post
Aint making a legit 600 at the crank
Popular Hot Rodding had a 408windsor with AFR 205's in a Ford Fairlane and way smaller hydraulic roller than mine, they made 445rwhp through c4 trans. So with my much bigger solid roller cam i should see at least 480rwhp, prolly 500rwhp with Man trans.

I'll post my results as soon as it's dyno'd. I'm guessin 475-480rwhp.
Goneinsixty is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-08-2010, 02:44 AM   #5 (permalink)
Tech Contributor Gold
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Amish Wonderland Of Central PA
Posts: 4,505
Garage
Re: 393 stroker rwhp

Quote:
Originally Posted by Goneinsixty View Post
Popular Hot Rodding had a 408windsor with AFR 205's in a Ford Fairlane and way smaller hydraulic roller than mine, they made 445rwhp through c4 trans. So with my much bigger solid roller cam i should see at least 480rwhp, prolly 500rwhp with Man trans.

I'll post my results as soon as it's dyno'd. I'm guessin 475-480rwhp.
You do know that Woody builds high performance Ford engines for a living? I would trust his opinion over any store bought magazine article hype that is meant to sell parts. Rear wheel dyno results are just fluff and can be manipulated as seen fit by the operator. These dynos are good to see what affect changes have on the vehicle, but even then they may not play out in real life.

The real RWHP dyno is the dragstrip and it does not lie.
__________________
Dennis

My little 65' Stang street car:



Dart 428W NA, 4 Spd, 4:33, on pump gas pushing 3550lbs.

10.494@128.76
dennis111 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-08-2010, 04:45 AM   #6 (permalink)
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Savannah, GA
Posts: 888
Re: 393 stroker rwhp

To Dennis' point, the power numbers in many magazine builds are often suspect. There is debate over which dyno provides the most useful information, but both engine and chassis dynos can be manipulated.

Also, the "big-time" engine builders typically have numerous performance "secrets" they have learned over the years to get every ounce of power out of an engine that the typical engine builder doesn't know or doesn't bother with.

That being said, I wouldn't make the assumption that because a similar engine in a magazine article with a smaller cam made "x" power that yours will make more. I'm guilty of making that same mistake!
I've made several trips to the chassis dyno, gone through a process of changes and adjustments, and never quite reached the "easy 450 RWHP" I thought it would make on my first trip to the dyno.

I wish you well and hope that you do make the numbers you want. When is it going to the dyno?
__________________
'67 Mustang coupe
New Dart 427 under construction: AFR 205's-Ported Victor Jr.-Mighty Demon 825-Cam TBD-Miller rockers-Hooker Super Comps-3" exhaust-AOD w/non lock-up 3000 stall-3.55 Posi-4wheel disc brakes

Last edited by kgordonl; 06-08-2010 at 04:51 AM.
kgordonl is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-08-2010, 09:38 AM   #7 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 100
Re: 393 stroker rwhp

Quote:
Originally Posted by kgordonl View Post
To Dennis' point, the power numbers in many magazine builds are often suspect. There is debate over which dyno provides the most useful information, but both engine and chassis dynos can be manipulated.

Also, the "big-time" engine builders typically have numerous performance "secrets" they have learned over the years to get every ounce of power out of an engine that the typical engine builder doesn't know or doesn't bother with.

That being said, I wouldn't make the assumption that because a similar engine in a magazine article with a smaller cam made "x" power that yours will make more. I'm guilty of making that same mistake!
I've made several trips to the chassis dyno, gone through a process of changes and adjustments, and never quite reached the "easy 450 RWHP" I thought it would make on my first trip to the dyno.

I wish you well and hope that you do make the numbers you want. When is it going to the dyno?

What r ur cam specs?
Goneinsixty is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-08-2010, 09:40 AM   #8 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 100
Re: 393 stroker rwhp

Quote:
Originally Posted by kgordonl View Post
To Dennis' point, the power numbers in many magazine builds are often suspect. There is debate over which dyno provides the most useful information, but both engine and chassis dynos can be manipulated.

Also, the "big-time" engine builders typically have numerous performance "secrets" they have learned over the years to get every ounce of power out of an engine that the typical engine builder doesn't know or doesn't bother with.

That being said, I wouldn't make the assumption that because a similar engine in a magazine article with a smaller cam made "x" power that yours will make more. I'm guilty of making that same mistake!
I've made several trips to the chassis dyno, gone through a process of changes and adjustments, and never quite reached the "easy 450 RWHP" I thought it would make on my first trip to the dyno.

I wish you well and hope that you do make the numbers you want. When is it going to the dyno?

Ur power numbers seem low for ur set-up. Could be ur high stall converter is eating a lot of horsepower.

As soon as the head cam install are complete it will be dyno'd, prolly within the nex 2 weeks.
Goneinsixty is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-08-2010, 02:28 PM   #9 (permalink)
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Savannah, GA
Posts: 888
Re: 393 stroker rwhp

Quote:
Originally Posted by Goneinsixty View Post
What r ur cam specs?
Split duration in the mid .240's @ .050 and just under .600 lift on the intake and just over .600 lift on the exhaust with a 108 lobe separation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Goneinsixty View Post
Ur power numbers seem low for ur set-up. Could be ur high stall converter is eating a lot of horsepower.

As soon as the head cam install are complete it will be dyno'd, prolly within the nex 2 weeks.
Maybe the numbers are low and maybe they're not, but those are the uncorrected numbers this particular chassis dyno spit out. I figure these numbers put me somewhere around 530-560 HP at the crank with even more torque, so I think the chassis dyno numbers are fairly accurate.

I also know that my AOD eats more power than other transmissions and my converter is pretty loose (it "flashes" more like 4500rpm), but once I ever get the car out of paint jail I plan to finally run it down the track and see what kind of power it really has and then go from there.

Keep in mind that as Woody pointed out you need a legit 600 HP at the crank to see about 480 at the wheels based on a 20% drivetrain loss. My experience has been that most people end up getting their feelings hurt by a chassis dyno.
__________________
'67 Mustang coupe
New Dart 427 under construction: AFR 205's-Ported Victor Jr.-Mighty Demon 825-Cam TBD-Miller rockers-Hooker Super Comps-3" exhaust-AOD w/non lock-up 3000 stall-3.55 Posi-4wheel disc brakes

Last edited by kgordonl; 06-08-2010 at 03:20 PM.
kgordonl is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-08-2010, 11:57 PM   #10 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 100
Re: 393 stroker rwhp

Quote:
Originally Posted by kgordonl View Post
Split duration in the mid .240's @ .050 and just under .600 lift on the intake and just over .600 lift on the exhaust with a 108 lobe separation.



Maybe the numbers are low and maybe they're not, but those are the uncorrected numbers this particular chassis dyno spit out. I figure these numbers put me somewhere around 530-560 HP at the crank with even more torque, so I think the chassis dyno numbers are fairly accurate.

I also know that my AOD eats more power than other transmissions and my converter is pretty loose (it "flashes" more like 4500rpm), but once I ever get the car out of paint jail I plan to finally run it down the track and see what kind of power it really has and then go from there.

Keep in mind that as Woody pointed out you need a legit 600 HP at the crank to see about 480 at the wheels based on a 20% drivetrain loss. My experience has been that most people end up getting their feelings hurt by a chassis dyno.

Your converter is flashing way to high for the cam and street set up that you have. My converter was a 3000 stall, but was flashing at 4500rpm like yours. Builder said to lower it to 2700 stall and it is much better now. My cam is a little bigger than yours, but u have 32ci on me. Previous cam i had was way to small for 3000rpm converter, new cam is perfect.

Wonder why your not puttin' out at least 600hp with a 425windsor. Maybe your cam is to small for the big AFR heads you have.
Goneinsixty is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-08-2010, 11:59 PM   #11 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 100
Re: 393 stroker rwhp

Quote:
Originally Posted by kgordonl View Post
Split duration in the mid .240's @ .050 and just under .600 lift on the intake and just over .600 lift on the exhaust with a 108 lobe separation.



Maybe the numbers are low and maybe they're not, but those are the uncorrected numbers this particular chassis dyno spit out. I figure these numbers put me somewhere around 530-560 HP at the crank with even more torque, so I think the chassis dyno numbers are fairly accurate.

I also know that my AOD eats more power than other transmissions and my converter is pretty loose (it "flashes" more like 4500rpm), but once I ever get the car out of paint jail I plan to finally run it down the track and see what kind of power it really has and then go from there.

Keep in mind that as Woody pointed out you need a legit 600 HP at the crank to see about 480 at the wheels based on a 20% drivetrain loss. My experience has been that most people end up getting their feelings hurt by a chassis dyno.

How much was your paint job and how long has the body shop been working on it.
Goneinsixty is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-09-2010, 01:07 AM   #12 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 63
Re: 393 stroker rwhp

THAT SHOULD BE INTERESTING. I TOO HAVE A CAR IN JAIL CURRENTLY BEING RESTOMODED WITH A 408W TO A TREMEC TKO 600 TO A 9'' REAR. ITS A 68 FALCON. LET US KNOW UR DYNO #s
DIAMONDBACK is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-09-2010, 03:10 AM   #13 (permalink)
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,741
Re: 393 stroker rwhp

My guess is your gunna make 400-420 RWHP. Like the others have said magazines are unreliable and many have very "generous" dynos. You can learn something from them but don't take their word as the end-all be-all of motor building. Lets see some dyno sheets! When are you going?
ujt389 is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-09-2010, 04:26 AM   #14 (permalink)
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Savannah, GA
Posts: 888
Re: 393 stroker rwhp

Quote:
Originally Posted by Goneinsixty View Post
...Wonder why your not puttin' out at least 600hp with a 425windsor. Maybe your cam is to small for the big AFR heads you have.
I didn't expect to make 600 HP when the engine was built. My goal was more like 550 at the flywheel peaking around 6000 rpm with tons of torque for the street and very driveable. I've pretty well accomplished that, but who knows, it may have a little more left in it.
The funny thing is, if my HP and TQ numbers were reversed (448 RWHP/423 RWTQ), that's more like I was expecting. After my last dyno session I discovered that my vacuum pump wasn't running during the pulls, so that may be worth a little more.

The point is, either way I will know more when I finally get this thing down the track. I even have a tighter converter already that was custom built by Broader Performance if I decide I need it. I actually started out at 357 RWHP/383 RWTQ at my first dyno session (that really hurt my feelings!) and used the dyno as tool to work through the issues and get it closer to what it should be. Now I'll let a run down the track tell me where I really am. Although, I may only get one shot at it since I don't have a roll bar!

If I had set out to make 600+ HP I would have started out with AFR 225's instead of the 205's, a Super Vic, more carb, and probably a different cam grind.
__________________
'67 Mustang coupe
New Dart 427 under construction: AFR 205's-Ported Victor Jr.-Mighty Demon 825-Cam TBD-Miller rockers-Hooker Super Comps-3" exhaust-AOD w/non lock-up 3000 stall-3.55 Posi-4wheel disc brakes

Last edited by kgordonl; 06-10-2010 at 11:17 AM.
kgordonl is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 06-09-2010, 04:57 AM   #15 (permalink)
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Savannah, GA
Posts: 888
Re: 393 stroker rwhp

Quote:
Originally Posted by Goneinsixty View Post
How much was your paint job and how long has the body shop been working on it.
Well, this is more than just a repaint. First there's the accident damage that the insurance company is footing the bill for. Then I decided to pay the difference in getting the whole car painted instead of just the panels affected by the accident repair. And then there's all the old damage uncovered during the other repairs. On top of that, I am replacing all of the old chrome, trim items, and I'm putting all the GTA trim on the car as well. I also have an open, fiberglass front valance going on the car for more air flow, so it has turned into more of a full-blown restoration now! When it is all said and done, almost the entire car will have been stripped back to bare metal.

The insurance company is on the hook for about $7k, I'm paying an additional thousand or so in labor and paint supplies on top of the other thousand or so I've spent on new chrome, trim, front valance, bolts, brackets, GTA pieces, etc. So it will end up in the neighborhood of $10k when its all said and done.

Check out my thread below. I will keep updating it as progress is made.

http://www.fordmuscleforums.commus...s-my-67-a.html
__________________
'67 Mustang coupe
New Dart 427 under construction: AFR 205's-Ported Victor Jr.-Mighty Demon 825-Cam TBD-Miller rockers-Hooker Super Comps-3" exhaust-AOD w/non lock-up 3000 stall-3.55 Posi-4wheel disc brakes

Last edited by kgordonl; 06-09-2010 at 05:08 AM.
kgordonl is offline   Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Ford Muscle Forums : Ford Muscle Cars Tech Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
02 GT looking for more RWHP KRyPTiNiTE012 Mustang Pages (1996-2004) 7 08-20-2010 06:48 PM
Put down more rwhp??? rebelman108 Mustang Pages (1965-1973) 7 01-23-2010 07:20 AM
more rwhp? rebelman108 Dyno Board 2 01-02-2010 09:16 PM
I Want More RWHP southern213 All Ford Techboard 11 10-21-2008 06:46 PM
help me get 300 rwhp! gorgan1314 All Ford Techboard 4 01-02-2005 12:21 PM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 09:53 AM.



Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
 

Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.