Solid flat tappet to solid roller - Ford Muscle Forums : Ford Muscle Cars Tech Forum
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post #1 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-20-2008, 01:48 PM Thread Starter
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Solid flat tappet to solid roller

Was wondering how much ET would be gained going from a solid flat-tappet to solid roller with similar duration numbers.

Current cam is 247/255 to a 248/254 roller both on a 106 lobe seperation
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post #2 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-20-2008, 01:52 PM
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Re: Solid flat tappet to solid roller

You need the "Complete" Duration Numbers not Just .050 to compair the profiles. FT and Mechanical Roller Profiles can be a whole lot different.

Also Lifts, Rocker Ratios and head Flow to see if it will make any gains.

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Last edited by dfree383; 10-20-2008 at 01:55 PM.
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post #3 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-20-2008, 01:59 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Solid flat tappet to solid roller

at .200 sft is 159/166 roller is 170/176
lift 560/576 614/621
same 1.6 rocker arms for both

heads are Stock Edelbrock RPM flow 250 @500
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post #4 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-20-2008, 02:38 PM
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Re: Solid flat tappet to solid roller

Wnat motor? How Many Inches?

Your Roller Cam is not the Same at the FT, Its quite a bit Larger.

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post #5 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-20-2008, 04:35 PM
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Re: Solid flat tappet to solid roller

I've seen 2 or 3 tenths on most applications, but i'm sure its not always true.
Way less friction....An all roller motor will rev twice as fast...
I'm a nobody but thats what i've seen....

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post #6 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-20-2008, 06:55 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Solid flat tappet to solid roller

it is a 393W
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post #7 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-20-2008, 08:33 PM
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Re: Solid flat tappet to solid roller

You should see again of about two tenths .You don't only gain on the lower friction but a roller is cut with a more agressive profile .This keep the valve at max lift longer filling the cylander better.This all depends on how fast your going now , the faster you go the harder it is to go fast.
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post #8 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-21-2008, 05:05 AM
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Re: Solid flat tappet to solid roller

I'm thinking you'll gain something in the 30-40hp range.

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post #9 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-21-2008, 05:24 AM
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Re: Solid flat tappet to solid roller

You may gain nothing, you may pick up a couple tenths. I know people on each end of the spectrum. You -should- pick up a little power, however don't expect it to be a different engine. A guy I know with a 351C installed a solid roller with apparantly the same specs as his solid, and ran exactly the same as he did before.

If it's a RACE car that sees limited street use, it might be worth it to step up to the roller. If it's a STREET car that sees a lot of miles, you'll probably be better off with a modern designed solid flat tappet... or a hydraulic roller if you don't rev it too high.

Engines that respond to solid rollers the best, are ones that need all the lift they can get. In other words, if the engine has fairly small heads for its displacement, it's going to need the valve lifted as far and quicky as possible, while keeping duration in check. A roller stands a much better chance of making a significant difference on this type of combo.

Your 393W with stock Edelbrock RPM heads would probably be a good candidate, as long as you don't mind keeping a CLOSE eye on the roller lifters, and it doesn't see TOO many street miles. Keep the idle speed up, and run a fairly tight valve lash to minimize pounding on the valvetrain.

Good Luck!

Last edited by n2omike; 10-21-2008 at 05:27 AM.
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post #10 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-21-2008, 03:42 PM
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Re: Solid flat tappet to solid roller

Hard to say without more details on the cams. But I'd say it'd be in the 15-25 hp range.

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post #11 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-21-2008, 05:39 PM
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Re: Solid flat tappet to solid roller

I have make cam changes somewhat like that an got a 57 HP increase-- I dont think anyone would go to the trouble of changing to a roller cam and not getting a better grind when they do it. I cant ever imagin getting the same specs when you want to upgrade your combo.The higher you rev the engine, the more room you have for improved performance from a roller.

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post #12 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-21-2008, 10:15 PM
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Re: Solid flat tappet to solid roller

Quote:
Originally Posted by n2omike View Post
You may gain nothing, you may pick up a couple tenths. I know people on each end of the spectrum. You -should- pick up a little power, however don't expect it to be a different engine. A guy I know with a 351C installed a solid roller with apparantly the same specs as his solid, and ran exactly the same as he did before.

If it's a RACE car that sees limited street use, it might be worth it to step up to the roller. If it's a STREET car that sees a lot of miles, you'll probably be better off with a modern designed solid flat tappet... or a hydraulic roller if you don't rev it too high.

Engines that respond to solid rollers the best, are ones that need all the lift they can get. In other words, if the engine has fairly small heads for its displacement, it's going to need the valve lifted as far and quicky as possible, while keeping duration in check. A roller stands a much better chance of making a significant difference on this type of combo.

Your 393W with stock Edelbrock RPM heads would probably be a good candidate, as long as you don't mind keeping a CLOSE eye on the roller lifters, and it doesn't see TOO many street miles. Keep the idle speed up, and run a fairly tight valve lash to minimize pounding on the valvetrain.

Good Luck!
I tend to agree but not with the last bit. I Haven't had anything to do with those particular heads but looking at their published flow data....they are virtually done at .500 lift... gain only 4cfm at .600 and flow drops at .700".
I would tend to think that because the heads are "done" early in the
piece flow wise, you are unlikely to gain much going to a roller.
In other words, if the current cam is meeting head (piston) demand , which is quite high with a 393, you will gain nothing by opening the valve sooner or giving it more lift as the heads flow "window" is already "full".

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post #13 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-22-2008, 05:15 AM
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Re: Solid flat tappet to solid roller

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Originally Posted by cmf60 View Post
I tend to agree but not with the last bit. I Haven't had anything to do with those particular heads but looking at their published flow data....they are virtually done at .500 lift... gain only 4cfm at .600 and flow drops at .700".
I would tend to think that because the heads are "done" early in the
piece flow wise, you are unlikely to gain much going to a roller.
In other words, if the current cam is meeting head (piston) demand , which is quite high with a 393, you will gain nothing by opening the valve sooner or giving it more lift as the heads flow "window" is already "full".
The smaller the head is for the combo, the more 'strangled' it is going to be. In this situation, it is very beneficial to get the valve open to where it needs to be as quickly as possible... then hold it there as long as possible before setting it down... all while staying within the required duration. A slow acting valvetrain on a small set of heads will give the engine 'asthma'. LOL

Nobody said a 0.800" roller was going to be installed in this 393W with RPM heads. A good roller with the proper lift would probably give this engine a nice little pick-me-up... especially if the solid cam that's in it now is on the slow side.

If the engine already had more cylinder head than it could really use, a roller probably wouldn't be worth that much over a good, modern solid flat tappet with the right specs.

Good Luck!
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post #14 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-22-2008, 11:17 AM
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Re: Solid flat tappet to solid roller

Quote:
Originally Posted by n2omike View Post

Nobody said a 0.800" roller was going to be installed in this 393W with RPM heads. A good roller with the proper lift would probably give this engine a nice little pick-me-up... especially if the solid cam that's in it now is on the slow side.
Some of the answer is already there......

Quote:
Originally Posted by 6T6Ford View Post
at .200 sft is 159/166 roller is 170/176
lift 560/576 614/621
same 1.6 rocker arms for both

heads are Stock Edelbrock RPM flow 250 @500

"Many claim experience and knowledge based upon how often they dispense advice" (Greg Banish)
Oh so true....
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post #15 of 20 (permalink) Old 10-22-2008, 11:41 AM
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Re: Solid flat tappet to solid roller

So, it looks like similar advertised and 0.050" numbers, but quite a bit more duration @ 0.200".

In other words, similar 'personality', but quicker lift, getting the valve up where it needs to be more quickly. Seems like a winner to me.
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