1973 mach 1 351 C-2V convert to 351 C-4V - Ford Muscle Forums : Ford Muscle Cars Tech Forum
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old 03-09-2009, 02:53 AM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 7
1973 mach 1 351 C-2V convert to 351 C-4V

Hi

recently I bought a 73 mach 1 with 351 Clevland 2V (177 BHP @ 4,600 RPM). the questions are:
1) what is the exact differences between 351 "H" 2V and 351 "C" 4V
2) Could I rich 300 BHP by changing the Carburetor and Intake Manifold or not, if the answer is Y, let me know if there is anything else to do.
3) If I do above, should I change the gearbox, suspention and ... too or not?

Thx
fstemp is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old 03-09-2009, 03:48 AM
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 352
Re: 1973 mach 1 351 C-2V convert to 351 C-4V

I don't know all the differences but the 4v had 4v heads too. Maybe a different cam. To reach 300 hp, that's all relative to your setup. Do you have headers or are you using manifolds?
latamud is offline  
post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old 03-09-2009, 06:34 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Merkel, Tx
Posts: 9,251
Re: 1973 mach 1 351 C-2V convert to 351 C-4V

You can put 4V heads on your 2V motor by changing the heads and intake manifold. in 73 there wasn't much difference really because both 2V and 4V heads used the same chambers, with the 4V heads having the larger intake ports typical of 351C 4V heads.

A carb and intake change might put the engine output in the 200~230HP area, depending. 73 cut compression way back and the cam is going to be small plus it is likely retarded at least 4 degrees, which also kills power.

You could upgrade your 2V engine with a carb and aftermarket intake, plus a cam change. It would be helpful to raise the compression in the engine, but that requires a lot of expense. A cam with the typical 204/214 specs should put you in the 250+ HP area and one with about 214/224 might get up up between 275 and 300, depending on the tune. Any cam installed in a 73 should use an aftermarket chain set and be dialed in with a degree wheel to get the most out of the change. There are a lot of 351C engine combinations you can review over at 351cleveland.net.




1967 Falcon 4 door 351C - 70 Mustang 351C
Owner built, owner abused.

Last edited by ckelly; 03-09-2009 at 06:37 AM.
ckelly is offline  
 
post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old 03-09-2009, 09:04 AM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 7
Re: 1973 mach 1 351 C-2V convert to 351 C-4V

Hi

many thx for the comprehensive replay, as I understand its better to replace the engine completely with a Nativity powerful one instead of spending a lot of money for the current engine. is it possible to fit a 429 engine on this model? it's possible for me to buy a used one and spend some money to put it in new condition. but I realy dont know about requrments and also dont know what other sections should be change after the replacment. also I didnt find any link about tuning, replacment, spare parts and so on.

Thx
fstemp is offline  
post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old 03-09-2009, 11:31 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 865
Re: 1973 mach 1 351 C-2V convert to 351 C-4V

Quote:
Originally Posted by fstemp View Post
Hi

many thx for the comprehensive replay, as I understand its better to replace the engine completely with a Nativity powerful one instead of spending a lot of money for the current engine. is it possible to fit a 429 engine on this model? it's possible for me to buy a used one and spend some money to put it in new condition. but I realy dont know about requrments and also dont know what other sections should be change after the replacment. also I didnt find any link about tuning, replacment, spare parts and so on.

Thx
It is always cheaper to build what you own assuming parts of it are still good (like the block for instance). Tearing the motor out and putting in a 429 will do nothing for you except increase your costs significantly and provide only a marginal return.
dodgestang is offline  
post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old 03-09-2009, 12:06 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Merkel, Tx
Posts: 9,251
Re: 1973 mach 1 351 C-2V convert to 351 C-4V

>as I understand its better to replace the engine completely with a Nativity powerful one instead of spending a lot of money for the current engine.
Never said any such thing. You'll spend more replacing it. The 351C is a "natively powerful engine" and as every engine starting in about 1972 was re-tuned for emissions and insurance reasons. They merely need updating. How much work depends on the engine condition.

>also I didnt find any link about tuning, replacment, spare parts and so on.

You have to search through the posts for that info. you can also buy a book and learn about your engine - Amazon.com: Ford 351C and Boss 351 Hi-Po (Musclecar and Hi-Po Engine Series): R.M. Clarke: Books

I'm sure somebody sells a set of mounts to put a 429 in that chassis - but they never got one from the factory. 1971 429 mounts might work. you would need a new trans, depending on whats in the car. As for the suspension, unless you spend some big bucks on the 429 for aluminum heads, intake, etc. you will be adding 200+ lbs to the nose of the car.




1967 Falcon 4 door 351C - 70 Mustang 351C
Owner built, owner abused.
ckelly is offline  
post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old 03-09-2009, 01:45 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Las Vegas NV
Posts: 3,700
Re: 1973 mach 1 351 C-2V convert to 351 C-4V

If you were to consider going with a 429 I'd say you should skip to a 460.

With my swap ... using parts to keep weight to a minimum ... the car had a gross vehicle weight increase of 60 pounds compared to the 351C it had in it before.

The swap is very do-able depending on your level of ability and inginuity and the 460 will give you a very definate difference in power.

This is what is in my 73 Mach1



Last edited by MonsterMach; 03-10-2009 at 08:45 AM.
MonsterMach is offline  
post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old 03-31-2009, 11:31 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 7
Question Re: 1973 mach 1 351 C-2V convert to 351 C-4V

Hello Guys

sorry because of my delay to replay, I was in vacation.

I'm confusing and I really dont know what should I do now!!!
351 or 429 or 460 or ..........

I know companies that could provide me high performance parts to tune up my current engine to rich 400HP to 800HP, they could do the same on 429 and 460. the problem is : I dont know which of the following methods are better:
1)tuining up my current engine
2)replacing it by a natively powerfull engine and then tune it!?

Infact something between 500HP to 600HP is ideal for me.
kindly describe the benefits and defects of each methods. actually I need your brilliant experience in this field to take my decision. the transmition of my car is C6 and its model is 1972. the engine model is 351C-2V.

thank you
fstemp is offline  
post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-01-2009, 12:18 AM
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Oahu Hawaii
Posts: 517
Re: 1973 mach 1 351 C-2V convert to 351 C-4V

Question: If upgrading to a 460 from a stock 351C, would you need to beef up the suspension for both front and back or did both 351C and 429 1971 mustangs share the same suspension setup?
G00S3N3CKB0BB3 is offline  
post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-03-2009, 04:20 AM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 7
Re: 1973 mach 1 351 C-2V convert to 351 C-4V

Hi

thank you guys, I take my answer but it seems it doesn't works for me. I'd like to get 450~550 HP and its not possible on this type of engine easily, then I start a new thread (replacing 351C-2V by 429 ) to earn more information about replacing the current engine by 429. please go to the following page and let me know your suggestions and opinions.

http://www.fordmuscle.com/forums/mus...-2v-429-a.html

thank you
fstemp is offline  
post #11 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-03-2009, 05:41 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 865
Re: 1973 mach 1 351 C-2V convert to 351 C-4V

Quote:
Originally Posted by fstemp View Post
Hi

thank you guys, I take my answer but it seems it doesn't works for me. I'd like to get 450~550 HP and its not possible on this type of engine easily, then I start a new thread (replacing 351C-2V by 429 ) to earn more information about replacing the current engine by 429. please go to the following page and let me know your suggestions and opinions.
450-550 out of a Cleveland is a walk in the park, I run that power level in my 410 stroker with stock 4v heads.
Putting in a 429/460 will require changing almost every piece in your drivetrain; for example...the transmission will not work and since it is a c6 you can't change the bell, so you need a whole new transmission.

I suspect English is not your primary language so I won't make a big deal out of it; but I and some others might take some offense to your continued reliance on the phrase 'natively powerful engine' when referring to taking the 351c out and putting a different motor in. The boss351 (which was a Cleveland motor) ran the fastest 1/4 times of any stock mustang until the Cobra SVTs in the 1999/2000 timeframe. The 351c is a natively powerful engine
dodgestang is offline  
post #12 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-09-2009, 01:57 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 7
Re: 1973 mach 1 351 C-2V convert to 351 C-4V

I couldn't agree more... Love the "C"

The Cleveland is big block power in small block clothing....
djfourmoney is offline  
post #13 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-10-2009, 06:43 PM
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: NW PA Grandvalley
Posts: 4,010
Re: 1973 mach 1 351 C-2V convert to 351 C-4V

At first he wanted 300 hp, now he needs 600. What the ??????? and why do you need 600 hp?

"Tell it like it is or don't tell it at all" 1964 Falcon 2dr HT, 347V8 4V, dual exhaust, 5sp, pwr assist R&P steering, AM radio, heater with defrost and 2sp fan, electric windshield wipers, cigar lighter, dlx light group, bucket seats, console and full carpet.
retyler is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Ford Muscle Forums : Ford Muscle Cars Tech Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
1973 Sprint/Mach 1 Mexican Dcollins85 Mustang Pages (1965-1973) 13 08-07-2008 07:27 AM
1973 mach 1 doGshOw All Ford Techboard 13 07-28-2003 03:47 PM
1971-1973 Mach 1 question! MightyMach The Garage 2 04-18-2003 09:03 PM
1973 MACH 1 axles... MightyMach All Ford Techboard 2 12-25-2001 02:20 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome