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Discussion Starter #141
Continued.....

gal500XL_2_05.jpg

There's the offset.

gal500XL_2_06.jpg

This is also very time consuming. The amount of hours is simply staggering to do a good job.

gal500XL_2_07.jpg

I made a bracket to hold the fuel lines where they will connect to the tank. I am using 6-AN stainless hardware.

Now I did have to remake one line as I screwed up the flare. Mistakes happen, they are maddening, but they happen.

gal500XL_2_08.jpg

gal500XL_2_09.jpg

I had to make a couple pieces here out of stainless for the front of the lines on the firewall.

gal500XL_2_10.jpg

If you're not "in the zone" and no not AutoZone, haha, when hand fabricating, you just have to quit and come back to it otherwise it makes a for a long painful night.

gal500XL_2_11.jpg

This is how I am mounting the lines to the front of the car, err firewall. They are out of the way of the wheel apron and will clear the eventual slew of Deutsch bulkhead connectors on the firewall.

gal500XL_2_13.jpg

They are presentable. These will also be flared for 6-AN.

Next up engine parts....
 

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Discussion Starter #142
Engine Parts, Engine Block Debacle and Tail Pipe Corrections.

This where the really maddening portion of the show starts. Since this 390 is a carbon copy of the one I built for the '66 LTD with the exception this one is getting fuel injected right off the bat and the '66 LTD will be converted to fuel injection as well. The reason why is we have a problem with carburetors specifically with fuel quality, elevation and hot days with the air con running where we live. As a result a carburetor is just a load of driveability problems come the heat of summer. Fuel will actually boil in the carburetor with the car running as evidenced with a Quick Fuel 750 on my Caprice Classic with the air con running and there's nothing you can do about it.

With this engine being a clone I needed to order another round of custom pistons from Diamond Pistons. But instead of the two week turn around normally it was closer to 9 weeks due to the goofy governor of Michigan. Now in the interim, the engine block was at the machinist. The pistons and camshaft came in and now he could finish the balancing of the crankshaft and fine machining of the block.

Here's some engine jewelry.

gal500XL_2_14.jpg

These are forged pistons with moly coated skirts, modern ring packs (1.5, 1.5, 3.0mm) and offset pins and a dome volume to yield 10.5:1 static compression with the heads and head gaskets I've chosen. The rings are moly coated with a gapless top ring. Also are new connecting rods.

Connecting rods have a life. There's only so many compression and tension cycles before fatigue sets in. The more power the engine delivers and the shorter the life. So with an unknown engine such as the turd with 2 gallons of water in the oil pan this was, god only knows. They went in the scrap pile and new stronger ones were bought.

Now you can get away realistically with reconditioning old rods if you're doing a bog standard rebuild as these engines weren't that powerful to begin with. But this engine will be no slouch when commanded so we're not taking any chances.

gal500XL_2_15.jpg


gal500XL_2_16.jpg

The kit also comes with pins and retainers.

gal500XL_2_38.jpg

The roller cam and new Clevite 77 bearings. Crane was also out of steel cores and this took a while to arrive as well.

So last week the engine was "completed" so I paid for it and toted it home only to find sloppy work. First it had been splashed with water or something else that was acidic because it had rust on parts of it.

Now I'm willing to overlook some sins as we all make mistakes, but when I pay for something I do expect the work to be done to a reasonable level and rust is not a reasonable level. The cooling jackets were still dirty and the cam bearings weren't all the way into the block with some overhang present. I was willing to fix all this at home till I saw the deal breaker. There was rust on one cylinder near the top. The rust was so bad it pitted the fresh bore at least 0.010".

That tore it.

I was a bit pissed to say the least. I paid nearly 1100 bucks just in machining and balancing and this. So it went back to him and he's going to have to sleeve the block which I'm not fond of bit there is no other recourse, he's acid flushing the cooling jackets and doing a better job to centre the cam bearings.

I'm sorry but there is no excuse for this run of the mill machine work lack of quality. The engine is supposed to be ready this week sometime. <sigh>

Now onto the exhaust. Again.

gal500XL_2_17.jpg

In case you hadn't noticed the loops over the axle aren't tall enough. Now weirdly enough I bought this same kit for the '66 LTD (same chassis) and the loops are plenty tall. In reviewing the pictures of the exhaust and comparing to the LTD pipes I bought a while back these aren't bent tall enough. So in other words more crappy quality I paid for.

Just super duper...... actually I said other things but I think you get the idea.

I will say this, never again will I buy prebent crap. I should have lobster tailed the complete exhaust system. Not only would it be substantially cheaper but it would be faster and made of much thicker steel. So for those who say I should have bought prebent pieces boy do I have the cannon loaded for yah.
o_O


Because I had set these pipes in reference to the body and bumper I didn't want to put all that back together as it's loads of work. So I had to fixture the pipes to the frame securely whilst I cut the loops apart to lengthen.

gal500XL_2_18.jpg

gal500XL_2_19.jpg

The tailpipes were indeed rigid to the frame at this point and surgery could commence.

gal500XL_2_27.jpg

There is no good way to fix this and for now this will do. This bothers me and afterwards when the car is done I will probably remake the tailpipes from scratch because this doesn't look all that great.

Speaking of not great, that was my mood in redoing this. But it's done.

Next up a better way to bolt things to the frame.
 

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Discussion Starter #143
A Better Way to Bolt Items to a Frame

gal500XL_2_20.jpg

Originally I threaded the frame for fine thread bolts to secure items like this front brake hose bracket to the frame. I wasn't terribly fond of this and so I found a better way. Now when Ford bolted items to the frame, they punched a smaller hole then extruded it through the other side providing more surface area for the threads to take hold.

gal500XL_2_29.jpg

Enter stainless steel Riv-Nuts and installation kit.

gal500XL_2_21.jpg


First here's the holes I originally drilled, granted I used fine thread AN hardware the frame isn't that thick. As you can see I am paranoid coming from the Midwest where the tin-worm is hard at work, so corrosion control is priority #1 next to strength.

gal500XL_2_22.jpg

Riv-nuts installed.

gal500XL_2_23.jpg

All new stainless hardware as well. Looks better and much more secure.

gal500XL_2_24.jpg

Did the other front hose.

gal500XL_2_25.jpg

And the rear fuel line bracket. Much better.

At this point I am done with the chassis till the engine is back together so it went in the other bay and I can start on the body.

gal500XL_2_35.jpg

gal500XL_2_36.jpg

All it needs is the engine. The bare engine block here is my 390 block from my '68XL used as a place holder to mount the heads to in order to mount the headers and do the exhaust system.

Next is scraping undercoat.
 

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Discussion Starter #144
Scraping and Wire Brushing the Undercoat

This is a truly seven layer suck cake if I ever had one. I removed the undercoating from the '66 LTD and it came off really easy with a propane torch. I don't think I spent 2 partial days on it and it was done. However the '66 LTD was taken care of and obviously garaged in Wichita Kansas.

This fine specimen along with another '66 gal 500 2 dr hardtop were extracted from the Zuni Indian Reservation. When I say extracted more like unearthed where they sat in a field in the hot dry desert sun since before I was born.

The heat of the countless years/decades cooked that undercoating as well as the paint on to a whole new level I didn't think was possible. I've kept track of the contiguous hours of just scraping and wire brushing with a small propane torch and it's now 28 solid hours of this and I still have a way to go.

Here's some before pictures:
gal500XL_2_30.jpg

It doesn't look bad, but there's rust forming under this factory undercoating.

gal500XL_2_31.jpg

gal500XL_2_32.jpg

gal500XL_2_33.jpg

I like how Ford loaded the undercoat on the area that would ultimately be coated with engine and tranny oil from 60's sealing technology (really lack of it) and left the more important areas devoid of the coating. <rolling eyes>

gal500XL_2_34.jpg


Now the fun starts. Well when I say fun I mean a truly grueling job.
gal500XL_2_39.jpg


gal500XL_2_41.jpg

gal500XL_2_52.jpg

As of the yesterday this is where I left off. I spent 2-1/4 hours and only cleared 2/3's of one wheel well. I went through 4 pounds of propane already. But you can see the revealing rust uncovered. This old undercoating has to be removed in order to treat this rust properly and stop it from getting any worse. I figure another 10 solid hours to finish this.

And people wonder why it costs ludicrous amounts of money to redo an old car.
:oops:


What makes this bad is that it's hard enough to be a * to get off, but soft enough where you couldn't sand blast it. When I blasted the exterior of the car, I tried some spots and the sand just embedded into the undercoat and that's all that happened, it didn't actually remove any of it.

The only other way is to acid dip the entire body, but either way you look at it, it's expensive to ship and dip or just pay the man hours to manually strip.

What makes this so bad is the seam sealer has asbestos in it, in fact it's just rubber and asbestos, so in removing this you have to get kitted up pretty well in a suit, full respirator and of course eye protection. I usually reserve this till later in the day when I can work with the doors open and not roast to death even with a fan running against me.

Next up a few misc bits of transmission and engine.
 

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Discussion Starter #145
Misc Transmission and Engine Bits

This is the latest round on the engine and tranny. I needed the straight pipe thread to 6 AN adapter for the cooler lines on the transmission. I don't have time to sit down and make sure the part is exactly what it says it is. In other words I can't double check every facet of a sellers part or their description. There simply isn't enough time in the day to do that to every single part. With that I occasionally have to trust a seller. I usually get screwed but tis the way it has to be when you're a one man band.

These cooler line adapters were no exception.

I ordered the first round of fittings.

gal500XL_2_43.jpg

Ummm no. The original double flare on the left and the adapter on the right. Wrong size pipe thread. The description says fits C6's..... Here we go again...

gal500XL_2_45.jpg

Bought another set that said fit C6 and this time I did check the description and the thread count and lack of taper was correct. Super.....

But it didn't fit. It wouldn't thread into the case and the O-ring they provided was waaaaaaaay to thick.

Oh good grief.

gal500XL_2_46.jpg

The thread pitch matches the one off the transmission soooooooooooooooooo......

gal500XL_2_47.jpg

okay.

gal500XL_2_48.jpg

You turd. <shaking head>

gal500XL_2_49.jpg


I find this, modifying brand new parts, the new normal sadly. Just ran it through a pipe die.

gal500XL_2_50.jpg

Now it threads right in and the O-ring seats properly now in the case grove. Something that should take 5 minutes took over 30 minutes. I really do pity the next generation of car buffs in dealing with this seemingly perpetual lack of concern/quality/caring/pride in others work and brand new parts. It was never this bad 20 years ago. You really do need a full compliment of tooling and experience to handle these situations otherwise you'll never get anywhere.

gal500XL_2_53.jpg

In this long duration of waiting on engine parts (pistons and cam) I was also waiting on Holman Moody for the FE super cobra jet oil filter adapter that has the oil cooler fittings replete with integrated viscosity by-pass valve. These are Blue Thunder reproductions. I also needed the bronze cam plate for the steel core camshaft as you can't run a steel core camshaft against the original steel retainer FE plate. They had the plate but I waited months for the oil filter adapter.

I was told they are made by an older gentleman and the feeling I got was they may not be available in the future. They are pricey, but when Holman Moody finally got a shipment in I said how many do you have. They said after months they only received two.

So guess what...

gal500XL_2_54.jpg


Now they have none.

I figured I needed one more for the '68 XL's 390. But if by chance I never get around to it I can always sell a brand new NOS one. And if they discontinue it the price of an NOS one in a box will skyrocket and then it will probably pay for everything I ever bought from Holman Moody knowing how old car parts follow closely the laws of supply and demand.

More to come.

Cheers
 

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I have a suggestion for you on the undercoating.
4000 psi pressure washer.
That’s what I used on my 66 and it took it all off with very little effort. Except for getting soaking wet. ;)
The pressure washer left a very thin film of undercoating that wiped off easy with rags soaked with varsol.
Another blast with the washer and done.
 

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I don't have room for a rotisserie so here's how I did it in my driveway.

165932


165933


165934


GALAXIE 044.jpg


The bit of black undercoat you can still see is a very thin film and as I mentioned, wipes off easy with some solvent soaked rags.

Before I did this I asked a friend that builds hotrods how he deals with undercoating...
... and he kinda hung his head and told me the propane torch and scraper bit, along with... "it's a B***h of a job, super messy, and STINKS!
So I very briefly tried the propane torch and scraper and thought there must be a better way....

I went away and thought about it... and happened to read an article in HotRod Magazine where they did the pressure washer thing.

So I went out and bought the highest rated 4000 psi pressure washer that I could afford.
13 hp Honda engine.
It's nasty with a "0" degree tip on the wand.
Will slice into a tire sidewall like nothing.
Don't ask how I know that....
I used a 15 degree nozzle on the wand for the undercoat.
Couple of hours and done.

Very glad I did it like this.

.
 

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On those C6 cooler fittings...

The early C6's have the fittings you show.... but the later (I don't know what year they changed) C6's have "ordinary/normal" 1/8 tapered pipe thread for the cooler fittings.

I "think" the early fittings are some kind of "almost proprietary" Ford kind of thing...
Or they are just straight pipe thread with O-rings....

I've noticed Ford sometimes uses weird uncommon fittings in some places on these older cars.
 

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Discussion Starter #149
I don't have room for a rotisserie so here's how I did it in my driveway.

View attachment 165932

View attachment 165933

View attachment 165934

View attachment 165935

The bit of black undercoat you can still see is a very thin film and as I mentioned, wipes off easy with some solvent soaked rags.

Before I did this I asked a friend that builds hotrods how he deals with undercoating...
... and he kinda hung his head and told me the propane torch and scraper bit, along with... "it's a B***h of a job, super messy, and STINKS!
So I very briefly tried the propane torch and scraper and thought there must be a better way....

I went away and thought about it... and happened to read an article in HotRod Magazine where they did the pressure washer thing.

So I went out and bought the highest rated 4000 psi pressure washer that I could afford.
13 hp Honda engine.
It's nasty with a "0" degree tip on the wand.
Will slice into a tire sidewall like nothing.
Don't ask how I know that....
I used a 15 degree nozzle on the wand for the undercoat.
Couple of hours and done.

Very glad I did it like this.

.
Howdy galaxiex,

Thank you ever so kindly for the suggestion of the power washer. It would have worked for our '66 LTD but on this car it sat basically in an oven for over 40 years straight and that undercoating is baked on. The paint was so baked on it was nearly unresponsive to dry sandblasting and I went through a ridiculous amount of sandpaper trying to strip a small section the regular mechanical way. It was so cooked on that when I tried industrial grade aircraft stripper all it did was make the paint shiny again. It was the most ludicrous thing.

The only way to practically strip the paint on the car was to use a 3100 PSI pressure washer with the sand blast attachment and the sheer force of the water coupled to the extra mass and sharpness of the coal slag did the trick. However like I mentioned earlier when I tried a section on the undercoating it didn't even phase it. This undercoat is on there. It's amazing what intense desert heat can do over decades.

I remember stripping the '66 LTD and I was done in hours, not days. The factory undercoating was still soft and just fell off with a little bit of heat and a wire brush, didn't have to scrape anything but the denser seam sealer.

Whilst our 3100 PSI is significantly less power than your 4000 PSI one, it would slice right into 5000 PSI concrete with the 0˚ tip on so I know what you mean. But if that coupled with coal slag didn't even phase the undercoating, I just can't see another 900 PSI doing much more on this car.

This is just "one of those things" I'm afraid.

Cheers
 

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Discussion Starter #150
On those C6 cooler fittings...

The early C6's have the fittings you show.... but the later (I don't know what year they changed) C6's have "ordinary/normal" 1/8 tapered pipe thread for the cooler fittings.

I "think" the early fittings are some kind of "almost proprietary" Ford kind of thing...
Or they are just straight pipe thread with O-rings....

I've noticed Ford sometimes uses weird uncommon fittings in some places on these older cars.
Hello again,

That's interesting about the later C6's. If that's the case (ha pun intended) then the first fittings I bought weren't made correctly either as they were 1/8 straight pipe thread with sealing washers. These FE C6's I have (4 of them) are 1/4" straight pipe thread. The company that made these fittings either used worn out tooling or specified the wrong diameter, as you can see it was only several thousandths difference.

Now I'm guessing it's a complete lack of quality control on their part as they also supplied a ridiculously large O-ring that is clearly wrong as well. Running their fitting through a pipe die corrected the problem.

It just seems to be this paradigm shift where you pay a fair price or sometimes more for something and it suffers greatly in quality control resulting in more man hours to correct it.

Cheers
 

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Wow, baked on undercoating and paint that is difficult (nigh impossible) to strip... just... wow...
Obviously we don't get that kind of heat up here north of the border... just doesn't get that hot here, well, not usually, and not for long periods.

A bit hard for me to fathom, but I certainly believe you, obviously you experienced it.

Ford cooler line fittings.
Ford used a variety of fitting types and sizes that I have encountered during my 40+ years in the trans business.
Depends on the year and trans type.
The straight pipe 1/4" with O-ring.
Straight pipe 1/8 with O-ring.
Tapered 1/8 pipe.
Brass Weatherhead type fittings with O-ring.

Those are the ones I can think of at the moment. There may be others.

Hope the rest of the build goes easier for you.
Cheers!
 

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Discussion Starter #153
Wow, baked on undercoating and paint that is difficult (nigh impossible) to strip... just... wow...
Obviously we don't get that kind of heat up here north of the border... just doesn't get that hot here, well, not usually, and not for long periods.

A bit hard for me to fathom, but I certainly believe you, obviously you experienced it.

Ford cooler line fittings.
Ford used a variety of fitting types and sizes that I have encountered during my 40+ years in the trans business.
Depends on the year and trans type.
The straight pipe 1/4" with O-ring.
Straight pipe 1/8 with O-ring.
Tapered 1/8 pipe.
Brass Weatherhead type fittings with O-ring.

Those are the ones I can think of at the moment. There may be others.

Hope the rest of the build goes easier for you.
Cheers!
Hello galaxiex,

I've never come across anything so stubborn as 40 year baked on paint and undercoating. For your and everyone else's amusement here's some pictures of the car after we yanked it out of the field.

166004


Here's what 40 odd some years soaking in the sun will do.
166005


Stick a fork in that interior, it's done....

166006


See how the paint is orange? That's the original bright red paint faded. When I tried the industrial grade aircraft stripper, after 1/2 hour, it just turned the paint bright red again, it wouldn't lift or blister it.

166007


For a car left for dead, it took less than 700 bucks to get everything working again, sans the dealer installed air con and the car driveable. We used it for getting the mail (2.2 miles away) for over a year. Even the radio dialed back to life. That winter it was -15 ˚F outside and it just started right up and stayed running. I have never seen a car want to live so badly, nothing fought me on reviving it. Of course a year later when I went to change the transmission fluid that was black and syrupy like, that killed it. Wouldn't move after that. The nasty original sludge was the only thing causing the hardened seals to somewhat seal and build pressure.

That was one baked car and now it will live on as an galaxie 500 XL instead of a plain jane galaxie 500.

Cheers
 

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Discussion Starter #154
This is amazing. The amount of time and patience put into this is mind boggling lol
Hello dustbuck,

Thank you, I think :geek:

We are probably doing something a little different than the average owner of an old car. We are building them to use as reliable comfortable daily drivers. In a nut shell it's turning back the time to 1966 for these two and just adding some modern amenities (fuel injection, power windows, locks, remote entry, disc brakes for this one, etc), so attention to detail is everything to make this happen without problems. My motto is if you can't trust your old car to drive cross country without any problems and be extremely comfortable in all conditions (heat, cold, rain, dust, etc) then it's back to the drawing board. These builds should last 20 years without major repairs if I do my job correctly. I myself have a '94 Grand Marquis LS fully loaded (digital dash, auto climate control, air suspension) that I use as backup and I trust it go anywhere, anytime and every single feature works on the car down to the power lumbar in the seats. My wife still uses a '96 Impala SS everyday and it gets 70+ miles per day put on it. It's probably the last full size full frame Chevy on the road as a high mileage daily driver.

In our eyes modern cars and trucks are just overpriced disposable appliances and so we choose to put the time and money into something with character, that's all.

Cheers
 

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You would have plenty of time if you weren't staging a diatribe of egomaniacal photographs.




Misc Transmission and Engine Bits

This is the latest round on the engine and tranny. I needed the straight pipe thread to 6 AN adapter for the cooler lines on the transmission. I don't have time to sit down and make sure the part is exactly what it says it is. In other words I can't double check every facet of a sellers part or their description. There simply isn't enough time in the day to do that to every single part. With that I occasionally have to trust a seller. I usually get screwed but tis the way it has to be when you're a one man band.

These cooler line adapters were no exception.

I ordered the first round of fittings.

gal500XL_2_43.jpg

Ummm no. The original double flare on the left and the adapter on the right. Wrong size pipe thread. The description says fits C6's..... Here we go again...

gal500XL_2_45.jpg

Bought another set that said fit C6 and this time I did check the description and the thread count and lack of taper was correct. Super.....

But it didn't fit. It wouldn't thread into the case and the O-ring they provided was waaaaaaaay to thick.

Oh good grief.

gal500XL_2_46.jpg

The thread pitch matches the one off the transmission soooooooooooooooooo......

gal500XL_2_47.jpg

okay.

gal500XL_2_48.jpg

You turd. <shaking head>

gal500XL_2_49.jpg


I find this, modifying brand new parts, the new normal sadly. Just ran it through a pipe die.

gal500XL_2_50.jpg

Now it threads right in and the O-ring seats properly now in the case grove. Something that should take 5 minutes took over 30 minutes. I really do pity the next generation of car buffs in dealing with this seemingly perpetual lack of concern/quality/caring/pride in others work and brand new parts. It was never this bad 20 years ago. You really do need a full compliment of tooling and experience to handle these situations otherwise you'll never get anywhere.

gal500XL_2_53.jpg

In this long duration of waiting on engine parts (pistons and cam) I was also waiting on Holman Moody for the FE super cobra jet oil filter adapter that has the oil cooler fittings replete with integrated viscosity by-pass valve. These are Blue Thunder reproductions. I also needed the bronze cam plate for the steel core camshaft as you can't run a steel core camshaft against the original steel retainer FE plate. They had the plate but I waited months for the oil filter adapter.

I was told they are made by an older gentleman and the feeling I got was they may not be available in the future. They are pricey, but when Holman Moody finally got a shipment in I said how many do you have. They said after months they only received two.

So guess what...

gal500XL_2_54.jpg


Now they have none.

I figured I needed one more for the '68 XL's 390. But if by chance I never get around to it I can always sell a brand new NOS one. And if they discontinue it the price of an NOS one in a box will skyrocket and then it will probably pay for everything I ever bought from Holman Moody knowing how old car parts follow closely the laws of supply and demand.

More to come.

Cheers
 

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If you don't like what you see - READ something else. I quite enjoy what she is doing. No reason for your negative energy.
+1 What a goofy thing to complain about. "Ooh - the pictures are too nice and probably took a long time to set up." Sheesh.
 

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Sorry Girls, I calls it like I sees it. If you want to drool over pictures of pistons encased in plastic bags then you might consider your own "energy", or lack thereof.
 
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