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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey guys I am building a 1965 Ford galaxie pure stock dirt circle track car. I have been trying to decide what engine would be the best to use for my application must be 2 barrel 4412 carb, maintain 15" of vaccum at 1000 rpms, steal heads, stock manifolds and stock intake, port and polishing is aloud and I believe stroking is too. I have been thinking either a 351w with alot of port and polish work and 1969-1970 heads or 351c and work on the oiling system some and maybe some aussie heads if I can find some and afford them or maybe just put custom pistons to help build compression. I was wondering what your guys opionions are and if you guys no any tricks to help get the most power possible with what rules I have to work with that would be great. If you think another engine would be better feel free to give your opinion I am just trying to find the best match up possible and not the easy way out and go with a chevy I am a ford lover and trying to find a way to be able to compete with chevy in the pure stock class sense the only thing racing is chevys Thanks
 

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I would run the 351 Cleveland for sure. I have raced Ford dirt track street stocks and have a friend who has also raced Fords on the dirt. We both ran Clevelands for a number of years. Don't let anyone tell you that the oiling system is a problem. At the rpms that you will run it will not be a problem. I have turned a 351C to 7100 in a dirt track car with no modifications to the oiling system other than a high volume oil pump, 20w50 Valvoline and some attention to detail. You can't beat the Cleveland heads, 2V or 4V. The factory Cleveland intake will also flow way better than a Windsor intake. Spend the money to have a carb professionally modified to work at the rpms you will run. It can make all the difference. If you will be keeping the rpms over 3000 to 3500 I would run closed chamber 4V heads as you will be able to use the bigger ports. Just make sure and run good valves. Factory valves will fail and make a mess of a good Cleveland motor. Consider having a custom cam made to take full advantage of the rules you must run under.
 

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Hey guys I am building a 1965 Ford galaxie pure stock dirt circle track car. I have been trying to decide what engine would be the best to use for my application must be 2 barrel 4412 carb, maintain 15" of vaccum at 1000 rpms, steal heads, stock manifolds and stock intake, port and polishing is aloud and I believe stroking is too. I have been thinking either a 351w with alot of port and polish work and 1969-1970 heads or 351c and work on the oiling system some and maybe some aussie heads if I can find some and afford them or maybe just put custom pistons to help build compression. I was wondering what your guys opionions are and if you guys no any tricks to help get the most power possible with what rules I have to work with that would be great. If you think another engine would be better feel free to give your opinion I am just trying to find the best match up possible and not the easy way out and go with a chevy I am a ford lover and trying to find a way to be able to compete with chevy in the pure stock class sense the only thing racing is chevys Thanks
try very hard for a set of Aussie heads or 2V heads that are well worked .

done right 2v's (USA) can get 13/1 c/r with flat tops on a 358 solid cam . car set up right , next year they will outlaw the Cleveland.

forgot about the stoking . if rules let you , build a 383C/393C . the chevy will be 383's or 400's
 

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try very hard for a set of Aussie heads or 2V heads that are well worked .

done right 2v's (USA) can get 13/1 c/r with flat tops on a 358 solid cam . car set up right , next year they will outlaw the Cleveland.

forgot about the stoking . if rules let you , build a 383C/393C . the chevy will be 383's or 400's
If he's allowed to go up in cubes he could do a 400 block with Aussie heads, bushed rods, and flat top pistons to get the CR up there. The added runner length should give him that little bit of extra power to REALLY stick it to them chevy boys. Also Braswell makes a pretty nasty 2bbl carb, but damn they're expensive for just a DD.
 

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If he's allowed to go up in cubes he could do a 400 block with Aussie heads, bushed rods, and flat top pistons to get the CR up there. The added runner length should give him that little bit of extra power to REALLY stick it to them chevy boys. Also Braswell makes a pretty nasty 2bbl carb, but damn they're expensive for just a DD.
400 wouldnt be a good idea for oval racing . lot of reasons . number one is , 383C can run the high RPM . 2 barrel still can run in the 7000+ RPM . not a good place for a stock rod 400
 

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A 400 wouldn't be a bad idea either if you are allowed to run that many cubes. I have seen a 400 turn 7000 RPMs in a dirt track street stock with closed chamber 4V heads and a 2 barrel carb. It stayed together too. It will be a little heavier but the cubes may be worth it. Just pay attention to the bearing clearances on the 400 as they are usually really tight on them. You could make some good compression with closed chamber heads on a 400. TMeyer has pistons for the 400 to get minimum deck clearance. But with closed chamber heads you will end up with no less than 12:1 compression though. What ever engine you run try and keep the deck clearance to a minimum for good quench. .040" is a good clearance with stock rods. I would run a solid lifter cam if you are allowed and are allowed to put an adjustable valvetrain on it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thanks for the replys guys yea I believe I have decided to go with the Cleveland it is manditory to run the 4412 Holley carb so I will have to make do with that and being I can't have very low vaccum I'm thinking about put a rv cam in or possibly havering one custom made to get as close as I can I'm ordering 2v closed chamber Aussie heads I'm gonna flow bench them to see if I can help them out in any way. I will run top of the line valves and springs and possibly see about porting the manifolds to get just a lil more out of them I prolly won't stroke my first Cleveland being this is my first race car lol try to keep her cheap this first year. Do you guys recommend any gears for my 9inch I was thinking 410 gears?
 

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Thanks for the replys guys yea I believe I have decided to go with the Cleveland it is manditory to run the 4412 Holley carb so I will have to make do with that and being I can't have very low vaccum I'm thinking about put a rv cam in or possibly havering one custom made to get as close as I can I'm ordering 2v closed chamber Aussie heads I'm gonna flow bench them to see if I can help them out in any way. I will run top of the line valves and springs and possibly see about porting the manifolds to get just a lil more out of them I prolly won't stroke my first Cleveland being this is my first race car lol try to keep her cheap this first year. Do you guys recommend any gears for my 9inch I was thinking 410 gears?
first car , first year .
your home track , does everybody start ? run a heat tob get in ?

Don't know the track you will be on or the level of compitition (chevy) you'll face . Best to get an idea what their builds are .
 

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351W, because it's 100 lbs lighter. Torque band is lower, and throttle response is quicker. Steel heads leaves you a lot. As long as the don't have to be a Ford production head. But then there's some good ones of those to. Smaller over all makes easier to work on.
More overall parts available to. 351W weighs just about what a SBC weighs so no weigh handy cap there. Makes a difference on handling too.
 

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351W, because it's 100 lbs lighter. Torque band is lower, and throttle response is quicker. Steel heads leaves you a lot. As long as the don't have to be a Ford production head. But then there's some good ones of those to. Smaller over all makes easier to work on.
More overall parts available to. 351W weighs just about what a SBC weighs so no weigh handy cap there. Makes a difference on handling too.
100 lbs !/? must be them smaller mains on the C and made up difference by the more air in the head ports .

Non oem iron , the bow ties are way head then , then there are those oem 5.7 vortechs
 

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Yeah, I doubt it's 100lbs. Maybe 25lbs if your lucky. The beauty of the Cleveland is that you can make some great power with the factory heads and intake. 2V or 4V. If you can't make the power that extra 25 lbs isn't the big concern. The Cleveland will keep up with those bowties. What made you choose a 65 Ford? I like seeing older iron used for an oval track car. Spares can be hard to come by though. You will need spares. Good luck with it. Post some pictures when the car is done. As far as gearing goes, it will depend on the tire size used and what RPM the engine needs to stay in the power range. I would check out what others are running for gears and the RPMs they are running. Then you can make a guess on what your car will like. If you are running a manual trans you could run a lower gear in the trans to get the gearing you want. Doing this though creates more drag that eats up power compared to running high gear which sends the power straight through the trans. If you run an automatic trans run all the gearing in the rearend and keep the trans in high gear.
 

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Go with the cleveland. Way better engine for constant high RPMs.... O! go with a high volume oil pump and you'll be just fine!
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I chose the 1965 galaxie cause I love the old cars and I got a heck of a deal on it lol the guys that's helping me out are Chevy guys and they all run 1940 and 1950 Chevys I believe they have 383 strokers and they have been running 410 gears but are thinking about trying something different. I am running an auto tranny this first year but I hope to be running a 3 or four speed car next year. The guys that's helping me are just as excited as me cause they said no one runs ford. So hopefully I can show them what a ford can do lol I'm shure my racing skills won't be the best but hopefully it won't take me long and I will be able to show them what a 351 Cleveland can do
 

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The Cleveland is actually smaller AND lighter than the Winsor (9.2" deck vs. a 9.5" deck). If you're stuck using factory iron go with the Aussie 2v heads since you will be able to find factory 2v intakes for dirt cheap. A high volume oil pulp is fine and all but make sure you've got yourself a high capacity oil pan with a windage tray and baffling as well so that you don't go dry in the turns or on hard acceleration.
 

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I chose the 1965 galaxie cause I love the old cars and I got a heck of a deal on it lol the guys that's helping me out are Chevy guys and they all run 1940 and 1950 Chevys I believe they have 383 strokers and they have been running 410 gears but are thinking about trying something different. I am running an auto tranny this first year but I hope to be running a 3 or four speed car next year. The guys that's helping me are just as excited as me cause they said no one runs ford. So hopefully I can show them what a ford can do lol I'm shure my racing skills won't be the best but hopefully it won't take me long and I will be able to show them what a 351 Cleveland can do
the chevy's with 4.1o gears .... know what transmission they run ? some run P/G's in low range with 4.10 gears .

with a 9' gears down to 7.50 ratio can be got today . do some research .

don't go by what the bow tie boys tell you , unless its chassis set up .

were are you located ?
 

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That would be cool to see a bunch of old iron racing together. Where are you from? What's the name of the track you are going to race at? You need to post some pictures of your car slinging clay when you get it going. There is a company called Predator racing cams that grinds custom cams here in Pennsylvania. A friend of mine had them grind a custom cam for his Pro Stock that he raced at Port Royal Speedway. The engine was a Cleveland with a 2 barrel carb. They were only allowed a .500 lift cam. He was very happy with their work. If it is in the budget you should consider a custom cam. With the minimum inches of vacuum rule a custom cam would make a big difference in making the most of the rules. I know you are just starting out, but it is something to consider once you get the car sorted out.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I live in central Missouri and the track I will be racing at is Lebanon midway speedway and I will post picks when I get her going I will get some of the other oldies too. I am a twin and my brother is working on a 1978 firbird he's doing 305 heads with 350 Chevy and port and polish and small cam I don't no what gears yet it will be fun to see who's got the better car lol we both love messing with old cars and trucks where both more of ford guys but he decided to go with a chevy
 

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That's cool. I am a twin too. My brother and I are both car nuts. I spent 28 years in the car repair business before I went back to school and changed careers. My twin still works in the car business. Both of us love to tinker with cars. My brother and I are both Ford diehards.Two years ago my wife and I were in Illinois to see the ARCA stock cars and the USAC Silver Crown cars at Duquoin Fairgrounds. I really enjoy traveling to different race tracks. You may have to take a guess at the gearing for your car and then you will know which way to go with it. At least you have a 9" inch rear to work with as there are plenty of ratios to choose from. You can always find plenty of 9" stuff at swap meets too.
 

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100 lbs !/? must be them smaller mains on the C and made up difference by the more air in the head ports .

Non oem iron , the bow ties are way head then , then there are those oem 5.7 vortechs
Yeah my bust, it's only 70 lbs on the Cleveland and 95 on the 351M/400s
480 for the 351W and 550 in351C, 575 on the 351M.
But then a 428 is 625.
Run a 351 Clevor?
 

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Yeah my bust, it's only 70 lbs on the Cleveland and 95 on the 351M/400s
480 for the 351W and 550 in351C, 575 on the 351M.
But then a 428 is 625.
Run a 351 Clevor?
I believe the weight difference is in the heads. Cleveland heads have a lot more bulk to them than Winsor heads do, but the power gains are enough to offset the weight difference.
 
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