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As you prolly know I am building a 393 stroker for my 1980 Fairmont Futura. According to the age old formula I have about the quartermile et/ speed , I came up with 11.05 /122.5 mph figure. What do you think?
Car weight 3200 lbs with driver. 1990 GT Mustang swaybars , gas shocks,subframe collectors,9" 31 spl axles, 4.11 gears,traction lok.Z-7003 T5 5- speed manual with 2.95 1st gear.Power Tower shifter, Red Line oil in the rearend/ trans,Centerforce Dual Friction clutch.Aluminum driveshaft.Track altitude 200 ft. above sealevel, air temperature 23 C( ="room temperature&quot
.Good traction track, used even by Topfuelers summertime.
Engine: 1972 351 W block, bored/honed to 0.030" using torque plates, honed smooth for moly rings.Decks machined to 0 clearance.CAT main girdle.Homemade windage tray, splash shields in the oilsump( 6.5 quart rearsump), 3.85" Scat crank, polished to 0.002" main clearance, rod clearance 0.0025".Scat 5.95" H-beams( abt 600 grams).JE forged pistons with reliefs( abt 520 grams).Moly rings filed to fit.CAT fluiddamper.Assembly balanced with 157 tooth Motorsport billet flywheel.
Compression ratio 10.8.
Heads AFR 185, ball milling marks in exhaust ports smoothed out with cartridge roll, intakes runners not touched.( flow around 280 intake and 190 exhaust at .500-.550).
Valve springs changed to Comp Cams 987: closed 128 lbs and 325 open (at .576).Rubber seals replaced with teflon ones due to interference with the damper spring.Crane 1.6 street economical roller rockers.Hardened Comp retrofit pushrods.
Cam: special retrofit Comp Cams 282 Xtreme Energy hydraulic roller( at 0.050 IVO 10 BTDC,42 ABDC, lift.566.Exh.54 BBDC,6 ATDC, lift .576.)Ground at 110 degrees lobe separation for added throttle response.Duration 232 I /240 E at 0.050.106 ICL.Comp Cams Hydraulic roller lifters& spider assy.Victor Jr.intake with 1 inch open spacer.750 Speed Demon double pumper carb. K&N 1000 cfm + airfilter.Fresh air scoop thru hood.Ford Motorsport 1 3/4" full length headers with 3.5" collectors , staggered bolt pattern / adapter plates. Open exhaust or 3" with x-pipe & straight thru mufflers.Small dia pulleys, electric fan.Aluminum water pump.Carter mechanical 100 gph fuel pump. MSD 6 AL + stock Ford electronic distributor with modified advance curve.MSD coil.
I havent decided about the rear tires yet...I am afraid about the T5...How much difference in et. would drag radials/DOT slicks/ real slicks make when compared to each other? Maximum tire size is 255/60/15-there is absolutely no space for a bigger tire.At the moment the rear suspension is stock but some kind of traction bars are going to be built.
We know that the Ford crate made 537 horses with very much the same combo as mine.The differences are:I have bit more flow at the exhaust side, pistons are good quality forgeds,the oilsump is good design with windage tray and splash shields, also have a 1" spacer and the cam is ground on 110 LSA instead of 112.
So let me know your predictions about the engine output and quartermile results.It will take few weeks before I´ll be able to take the car to the track,however.I´ll let you know then.
 

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I would be afraid very afraid of two things. #1 that t-5. A 2.95 t-5 with low miles will fetch $700 on ebay. A broken one will get about $150. Get your $700 out of it and put it towards a something that will take the abuse for more than a couple of passes. #2 I really don't think the fuel pump is large enough. If it is rated 100gph at 5 or 7 psi, you are probably ok, but if that is free flow I would be worried. Fix those two things and you should meet your goal.
 

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You should have the power for tens...but ET is all about traction. You will need 60 fts probably in the 1.50's. You will need slix. IF your 9 inch is the same width as the stock rear your should be able to run a 28x9 with proper wheel....your going to need the longer footprint of the 28 vs the 26 inch tall slix. Your going to lose the T5Z but it will be russian rolette...it may go 150 passes it may go 5
The T5Z is a much better tranny then the stock 87-93 5.0 T5 and the smaller diff between the 1st and 2nd gear is a big help.Your going to have to come off the line hard....5000+ rpm launches and clean fast powershifts for max ET. The front swaybar will probably have to come off. I hope you run a scattershield.
 

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I can see it with very good traction using a stock T-5 while not power shifting it. I have seen the T-5s handle deep in the 9s without breaking but you can't power shift it. an 850DP or larger carb with you std trans and steep gears. That's going to be one fun car to drive, that's for sure. Enough traction for a seriously hard launch in the 1.40s, not without working the rear suspension over with aftermarket control arms(adjustable preferred) and remove front sway bar and making a higher front ride height for a totally level stance and you may have a chance.
 

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I've got almost the same engine in my mav, with a few exceptions. I'm using Vic Jr heads, out of the box, and a 260-266 @.050" .672 solid roller. Compression is 11.2:1. I also have an 850 HP holley, 1 3/4" headers, 3" open collector. Car weighs 2700 lb (approximate). I'm also using a 'Glide trans 1.82 low and 28x10.5" ET Drags. Best 60' so far was 1.41, best 1/8 et was 6.66 @ 109 mph. I dont have any idea what it calculates into for a full 1/4 mile, but I figure either way, it should be pretty close to what your fairmont should run.
 

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That's around 10.30-10.40 in the quarter at around 128-130MPH. Good solid combo mavman. Do you street drive it at all?
 

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nice combo maveman I hope to have a 393 that will put us in the 11's...but it has to be sreetable of course


But I have to say this....ville's combo is not even close to yours. Your running WAY more camshaft...more compression, bigger carb and your #500 lighter. In drag racing those are BIG differences. There is no such thing as almost the same.
And rowing a T5 with 500+ hp up front is no small chore for the once and awhile drag racer. Even my milder mid 11 sec(#3400...fully loaded) 90 5.0 5 spd(T5Z) LX hatch was hard to drive "right" everytime...if I ever did
I have seen T5Z"s more then once turned to junk powershifted or not. If a T5 went 9's(and they have) they wont do it for long and its only a matter of time before it grenades. Just like a 5.0 block going 9's it will be junk before long...know of more then one that once taken apart the block fell into 2 pieces
Small tire manual trans cars are animals...fun but its like being a lion tamer
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Thanks for your input guys.Comments /questions:
I believe I better disconnect the front sway bar at the track.The susupension is set up for high speed stability rather than quartermile.Rear controlarms are boxed and fitted with new rubber bushings( I had urethane ones but were too noisy). I am sure I need to build up somekind of traction device to help control wheel hop.
Its a good advice to run a 28" tall tire instead of a 26, this way the contact patch can be improved without having a wider tire.
What you´re saying about the T5...I believe you´re right- It will last sometime but will break eventually.
I dont run a scattershield but the flywheel is a billet steel one and the clutch is a brand new Centerforce DF...it´s hard to believe that those would explode..what do you think.If I go to a different trans I quess I need to get a different clutch housing/scattershield anyway.
Fuelpump...I will start with my current one and run a pressure mete which is visible during testing.If the pressure drops, say below 3 psi ( ?) then an upgrade is in order...what would be the lowest pressure acceptable ?
Mavman, your combo is definitely a lot faster than mine.Sounds really awesome..yeah, do you run it on the street?Zero to 109 mph in 6.66 seconds....that will leave even most of the superbikes in the dust.That´s what I like!
 

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Discussion Starter #9
89 coupe / Kent, any time info about yr tip to Latvia/Finland yet?
 

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ville, I was going to e-mail you back the other day about that but I forgot. Looks like the wife's family is going to fly to the US and stay with us for the summer(mother and sister). We don't know when the next time we go over will be since my wife may be pregnant again so it might be a year before we can go again unless she goes before having the baby(if pregnant). I'll get back to you a little later with more details.
 

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Ville, please, please, please, at least put a blanket on that thing. Got a buddy that races a Falcon with a 250-6. I know, I know, but he won't swap to a v-8.

Couple years back, he put in a brand new centerforce. It lasted 'bout 10 passes and blew up, and I mean BLEW UP! Blew the starter out of the bellhousing, straitened the springs in the clutch straight out and left a gouge(sp) in an explosion proof bellhousing that got 1/2 way through plate steel.

After a call to centeforce they sent him a new clutch. After a dozen passes it did the same thing. I told him that if he put in another one I'd hit him in the head with it.

My buddy leaves like a pro-stocker but, imagine this clutch behind 550hp instead of a 250-6.

I'm not one to bash someone's product but the site of what these clutches looked like after removal left me speechless. Please look out for you legs.
 

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Definitley good advice. A 10 second manual tranny combo with a stock bellhousing is rolling the dice big time. Saw a guy lose half a foot when I was a kid when his clutch let loose on a gasser. The pressure plate landed at my feet, buy they never did find his toes. I'd hate to see you have to switch to an automatic out of physical necessity, if you know what I mean..
 

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Ok...hear what you´re saying.Health is the most valuable thing in life so I am not gonna risk it. Thanks guys.Personally I´ve never seen a clutch explosion,I am sure if I did I didnt ask that question in the first place.
Kent, ok , we´ll do it next time!
 

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I'll let you know when I have a solid date to give you. This will be fun but now I need to make sure it's in the middle of summer when there is light nearly all night long. I've never had the opportunity to be where there is daylight nearly 24 hours a day. Does that mean there is cruising all night long?
 

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with good 60's you should make it. I have 1 5/8" headers, a 650 demon, Ported RPM's, a 230 @ .050 cam and I'm well into the 11's with a 2920 lb car.

I'm anxious to put on my ported vic jr's with a real cam and see what it'll do. Need traction though.
 

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Kent, june/july/august would be the best time.At cruise nights the cruising can go endless from friday evening to saturday morning and it does not get dark at all...those nights there´s magic in the air.
 

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65mustang393: would be nice to know more about your combo: rearend ratio, trans, tires, converter,60 ft time, compression, cam specs etc.How is the streetability and the powerband of the engine?Anything you would like to recommend at this stage I am assembling my 393?
 

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The rear is an 8" with 3.55's and a detroit locker.

I build my own c-4's, but nothing too out of the ordinary.

Good intermediate servo (PA super or Ford H).

Good input shaft (4340/vasco).

5 clutches in the forward drum (which is common) and 5 clutches in the direct drum (which you can do by using forward clutches because they are .061" vice .078&quot


Full manual valve body I think is a must to get rid of 2-3 flare up. I got mine from Dynamic.

The PA roller set up is the best for the price unless you get your c-4 parts machined. They dicuss rollerizing c-4's in the c-4 archives section.

The converter is a 10" from Dynamic. All my times were run with a 10" from DACCO, though. If you use a auto just get a converter with a chromemoly turbine hub (where shaft goes in) otherwise 393 + N2O ='s shredded tubine hub splines!

Compression comes to be ~10.3:1 due to gasket thickness and not decking block. Runs fine on pump gas with about 32 total timing.

Cam is 230/238 & 514/525 with a 106 lobe seperation. Schnieder cam from flatlander racing.

Lots of torque. Not really a good combo for HP. Light car ='s good times. T-5 won't like you very much!

Wished I would have used a main girdle. Everything has ARP bolts.

Used Eagle H-beams, but H's are so heavy it cost a lot to balance (had to use 3 slugs of mallory). Would recommend SIR's or the really nice I-beams that Probe/Dyno-Flo sell.

Should have used forged pistons, used Federal mogul H273CP's. They've held so far but I'm a little worried about using a bigger shot.

RPM heads flow 250/202 but I feel they are maxed out.

You'll like it. You can't beat cubes, that's why I want to make a 418 next!

60's are a best of 1.71 on N2O, and 1.67 on motor. MT 26x10.5x15 ET streets. (too small)

We only have 2 vehicles so my wife has to use the car when I have the truck. It's really streetable, but can get old if you drove it everyday. Maybe 2-3 times a week is ok.
 

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Thanks for the info...looking really forward to get my engine together.
I did not have any difficulty in balancing...the H-beams and SRP forged pistons were actually " too light" - the crank counterweight needed a lot of drilling.I red a post here some time ago that the newer SCAT cranks are heavier, perhaps that´s the explanation.
Is the Schneider a roller cam?
Those AFRs flow around 280/185out from the box-bit more than the Ebrocks.
 
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