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What kind of rpm are you planning? Power adder?

Some say 550. Others say more like 650 or better. It is a much stronger block than the 302.
 

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Just an observation - Lots of the stroker compaines have dropped this combo due to poor reliability.
 

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Common Census on max HP for Stock Blocks is 500-600 depending on operational conditions, Like Drag Use, Endurance Use, Etc. They will take alot more but failure is enevitable and unpredictable. You have to watch side loading and stresses when using the stroker kits. They will also limit your rpm potential depending on the quality of the components you use. The 392/393 and 408 combos seem to be more popular (probably more reliable with a stock block).

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1991 LX Mustang 347 C4 combo Mid 11's with the AC on.
1984 Mustang GT 460, Powerglide "Still putting it together" hoping for 9's !!

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: dfree383 on 2/28/06 11:28pm ]</font>

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: dfree383 on 2/28/06 11:32pm ]</font>
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Just how many years would you guys istamate it last, no more than 10 times at the track (trailered there and back) a year and cruising a few times a month?
 

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I just dug up some pics of my old 357w that grenaded. It was just a regular stock stroke 351w, alky-injected with around 14.8:1 compression (bracket car engine). Made approximately 550 HP and I shifted it at 7400 and crossed the finish line at 7500. The weak link is the main webbing. The rest of it was fine.







If you'll look closely at the last pic, you'll see how thin the main webs actually are. A poor balance job combined with lots of RPM (and a little funny fuel) is what caused this E4AE block to exceed it's limits. The crank was also broken...in 4 chunks. The engine developed a low oil pressure situation about 4 races before the end of the season (~25 psi, hot, cold, and at any RPM) and I figure that the main web(s) already cracked and was allowing pressure to "leak" at the cracked area(s). The last race of the season I decided to play with some "fuel" and on a 25% mix I found myself with a 1.22 60'....but a completely locked up engine at approx 250 feet out. Sure was fun for that first couple seconds, then just a huge loud cracking noise that was heard from the tower, as well as across the pit area. Lots of folks thought there was a wreck...and...well they were right. I wrecked the motor.

Now, I have only seen a couple 427w's put together, and one is still kicking today. It's basically just a really mild long stroke 351w that is in a '66 F100 that a friend owns. He drives it maybe 3 times a year at the most so even though it's about 4 years old, it might have a total of 50 miles on it. He does seem to like it (the 427) though.

I do need to mention that I am partial to the 408 engine though. I have 2 of them as we speak, one on the stand (as a back-up) and another that is in the Maverick. It runs great, for a fairly low-buck build. Just a cast crank, H beam, Mahle piston "kit" that I threw together in my spare time....and it replaced the grenaded 357. How does it compare? Same camshaft, same induction, same headers, tires, gears, everything...only difference is that I had one of the heads welded up (no porting) and I concreted the 408's block instead of running water in it (alky motors don't need much in the way of cooling). Picked up a full .4 in ET and I believe 9 (was 118....running 127 and change now) mph...just by increasing the stroke.
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<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: mavman on 3/1/06 10:46am ]</font>

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: mavman on 3/1/06 10:51am ]</font>
 

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I am running a 427 Windsor in my '66 Fairlane. I used a "C9" block. The lower end is much beefier than later ones. I also used a main stud girdle. I think this is an awesome combination. It has so much torque which makes it really streetable. I have a 750 vac. sec., column shift automatic and 3.50 gears behind it, and it runs 12 flat and picks the front wheels up. I can cruise around all day on pump gas and the temp never exceeds 190 degrees. Four years of cruising and drag racing with no problems.
 

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the 351c is a shorter deck block than windsor which increases the side loads when stroking it. the only advantage there might be if you found a 4 bolt main block, & even then i would worry more about the rod angle on the stroker.

393 & 408 seem to be the best stroker combos for the 351w, altho i know of a guy running low nines with a 427 stroker. no word on longevity yet.
 

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Anyone ever went the other way with the 351W block? De-stroking seems to be a bad word today. But in the past it was used as a way of improving reliablity, breathing and block longivity.

Seems like 302 journal diameter crank...maybe set to run a 331 displacement, would be stronger and rev better than a 302 based engine of the size?

Any bench racing comments on that combination?

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Beoweolf on 4/14/06 11:10pm ]</font>
 

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351c blocks suffer from thin walls and are no better of a choice than a 351w block. The only real cure is an aftermarket block. You need to watch journal sizes on high HP motors (and journal overlap) it really affects the durability and strength of a crankshaft.

As far as destroking its all in the intended use for the motor if your looking for a 11,000 rpm motor a 3" stroke is going to be safer than a 4"..............

Let face it their are pratical limits to stock design blocks, sometimes they last sometimes they don't.......

_________________
1991 LX Mustang 347 C4 combo 11's with the AC on.
1984 Mustang GT 460, Powerglide "Still putting it together" hoping for 9's !!

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: dfree383 on 4/14/06 11:22pm ]</font>
 

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On 2006-02-28 15:01, MrGonzo wrote:
Just how many years would you guys istamate it last, no more than 10 times at the track (trailered there and back) a year and cruising a few times a month?
How long is forever? Never know how long one will last, can you tune an engine? Will you ever over rev it? are all the components new? has everything been machined correctly? was it assembled correctly? Are you intending on useing high quality parts or imported stuff.

a typical 408-427 stroke should last a long time in the application your describing. but who knows.
 

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I like the 4.1 forged kit as max stroke. .040 this would be a 421. Im using a D4 block for this as my "next" shortblock. The current D1 block will be used for this "budget" 393W that is going together for next year. All my stuff is 6.4K rpm pump gas driver stuff so I dont see probs with durability. Now if you do what mavman does....well.


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Tim

81 Mustang 351W/AOD 12.13 111.7
87 octane...street and highway driven.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: qtrhors on 4/15/06 12:51am ]</font>

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: qtrhors on 4/15/06 12:52am ]</font>
 

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I'm doing a 4.1 stroke in a D4 block at .060 (425ci) right now.
Its half filled and recieving 4 bolt spayed caps.
Im hoping it holds up.

There is quite a bit of difference in the webbing between the eary and later model blocks. There is even a noticable difference between the same casting number. I have two D4 blocks that the registers are quite a bit different. One is almost completely flat across the registers and the other has nearly .100 recesses.
 

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I ran a stock '69 block with a 4.2" stroke crank, 6.250" rods, and probe pistons. The motor was making 510 rwhp through a C6 and never experienced a problem. It has about 12,000 miles on it.
Tore it down and there is cylinder wall wear and the pistons are worn. The rest looks great.
You might talk to Mark at Probe about this combo since he's helped a bunch of us out and has much more data than I do about the longevity of such a combo.

I did size down my next motor to a 418 because the parts were off-the-shelf vs custom. Amazing what 10 years does to the aftermarket supply.

The 418 makes the same power but naturally aspirated. Running a Ford sportsman block this time.
 
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