[Pennyduke]

Hey guys, I'm new here and in the process or rebuilding my C4 and I have a few questions if y'all don't mind. This C4 will be used in a Bronco with mostly street driving and some light trails. It's behind a 306 with a mild cam and is about 300 hp.
I have it disassembled and at the machine shop for cleaning. I bought a full rebuild kit with red Alto clutches. I already drilled the #9 lube hole, and return line passage all the way through to the rear bearing. to 3/16" inch. I also removed the spring and 2 check balls in the pump and plugged the hole. (all great info I got from this site)

Question #1 Do you still recommend drilling holes in the forward and reverse clutch pack housings? (Broader performance says they no longer do that but do not explain why)


Question #2 The clutch disks sent to me do not have the waffle pattern on the 4 disks for the Direct clutch. They are all smooth. Is this something I need to worry about?


Question #3 Is there any other upgrades I should be doing other than a Shift Kit?


Thanks for any help you can give. I'm sure I will have more questions as I go along. Thanks

 

[gregaust]

I don't drill the forward drum.
The high/reverse can benefit from some small holes on the outer to let oil flow through . I have seen Broader mention tehy don't , i'd be curious as to the reason.

I have used both the smooth and waffle frictions . I do prefer the waffles based on principle but the smooth frictions work fine also. Have used the smooth Alto reds many times.

If you can drill the sungear or get a C5 sungear that puts some added oil to lube the gearsets.

Use a transgo 40-2 kit is a good choice.

See what intermediate servo you have . Some are better than others . Also ensure the front planet set is good . Most now are near worn out .. That should give you good service

 

[Pennyduke]

Is it possible to mix up the piston seals in the 2 drums? I have the forward clutch assembled and have .045 clearance. I started on the high reverse drum and don't feel confident that I used the correct o-ring in the forward drum piston. Are they the same size? Thanks again

 

[galaxiex]

Is it possible to mix up the piston seals in the 2 drums? I have the forward clutch assembled and have .045 clearance. I started on the high reverse drum and don't feel confident that I used the correct o-ring in the forward drum piston. Are they the same size? Thanks again

The outer rubber rings on the pistons are different.
I usually compare the outer piston diameter, one will be slightly larger in diameter.
Then compare the rubber rings, it's not hard to tell which goes where when you compare them.

The inner rubber rings;
The forward is an o-ring and the high reverse is a lathe cut, or square cut o-ring.

 

[gregaust]

The outer rubber rings on the pistons are different.
I usually compare the outer piston diameter, one will be slightly larger in diameter.
Then compare the rubber rings, it's not hard to tell which goes where when you compare them.

The inner rubber rings;
The forward is an o-ring and the high reverse is a lathe cut, or square cut o-ring.

Yes exactly. The high drum outer seal is slightly larger diameter than the forward

 

[gregaust]

Also , .045" is too much clearance on the Forward . Need to set at the lower end of the specs , .025" -.030" is good

 

[Pennyduke]

I do remember now that the forward was a O-ring (round cut) and the same size as the old one. (just a hair smaller). So I'm positive I have it right now.

I have a spare C4 that I took apart and put back together for practice before I started this one. I will see if I can get a thicker snap ring from it to tighten up the clearance.


Thanks for the help. You guys are awesome...

 

[Pennyduke]

I used the 0.080" snap ring from the Belleville spring in the spare trans. Now I have 0.30 clearance in my new forward clutches.

If I buy a kit to add 1 friction disk to my High reverse clutch, What clearance should I shoot for? Thanks

 

[gregaust]

5 frictions in the high/reverse around .040"

 

[Pennyduke]

If I buy a Sun Gear & Sun Shell from a 1981-86 C5, Would it fit without any modifications? The one I'm looking at has 4 holes at 3/32 in the gear. Thanks again

 

[gregaust]

If I buy a Sun Gear & Sun Shell from a 1981-86 C5, Would it fit without any modifications? The one I'm looking at has 4 holes at 3/32 in the gear. Thanks again

Yes will swap straight in .

 

[Pennyduke]

Well I'm close to the end of my rebuild. Everything went smooth. I really took my time and made sure everything was correct. Before I started my endplay was 0.041. I used all new Thrust washers and now I'm getting 0.0.021. I have a #2 Thrust washer that is a little thicker that came with the kit. Am I ok with 0.021 or should I make it less?

I added the #9 cooling hole with a C5 Thrust washer and added a kit from Broader Performance to add 5 frictions to the High Reverse clutch.

I also added a C5 sun shell and gear with the 4 oil holes. Reamed the real cooling return line and took the 2 check balls and spring out of the pump.

The Shift Kit came today so I'll be doing that next.

Awesome site, Thanks everyone for getting me this far...

 

[galaxiex]

Well I'm close to the end of my rebuild. Everything went smooth. I really took my time and made sure everything was correct. Before I started my endplay was 0.041. I used all new Thrust washers and now I'm getting 0.0.021. I have a #2 Thrust washer that is a little thicker that came with the kit. Am I ok with 0.021 or should I make it less?

I added the #9 cooling hole with a C5 Thrust washer and added a kit from Broader Performance to add 5 frictions to the High Reverse clutch.

I also added a C5 sun shell and gear with the 4 oil holes. Reamed the real cooling return line and took the 2 check balls and spring out of the pump.

The Shift Kit came today so I'll be doing that next.

Awesome site, Thanks everyone for getting me this far...

.021" end play is fine.

Building stock trannys I used to go as tight as .007" .008" , but around .012" .015" is ideal.

 

[gregaust]

So you did set the endfloat with the small thrust wsher on the end of the stator support?

Then select the #1 washer between the high drum and pump so it is a snug fit???

Just checking . If so then the .021" is fine

 

[Pennyduke]

Yes and Yes, I followed a Post you did on how to set End float. My Thrust washer kit had 5 selective pump washers and I used one that was snug but not super tight.

Do you have ant tips on selecting the correct sealing rings on the Stator? It seems like a guessing game to me. I matched them up the best I could and it seems right but I don't have a good feeling about it. Thank You

 

[gregaust]

Well done on the endfloat ..

As for the rings , The high/reverse are all the same . Clip the rings together and trial fit in the clutch drum bore . I trial fit every ring before fitting on the stator support.

For the forward rings here are two different widths , early vs later . Again trial fit in the forward drum. Then if a nice fit , assemble to stator support.

Believe me trial fitting like that is essential. I have had an incorrect ring that was very slightly undersize and a loose fit ..

Also check the rings in their grooves on the stator support. Steel rings should be fairly snug with a few though side clearance.

Teflon rings are usually a looser fit in the grooves . Early and late are different rings for the different width grooves . Trial fitting Teflons in the drum is the same method .

 

[Pennyduke]

Thanks, I will test fit the rings just to be sure. One question on the Valve Body and shift kit install. The 2-3 backout valve has a spring that goes in last and rides against the plate. Do I need that spring? My other valve body does not have a spring there. Not sure why

 

[gregaust]

That spring is not in all valvebodies . The Transgo kit does say it is optional to use . Some kits actually use a blocker in the 2-3 backout. I have also blocked that valve with a checkball in some of my own mods . You could IMO leave that extra spring out . From memory a Transgo spring is a bit heavier than original and may also partilly block that valve.

 

[Pennyduke]

The pump rings checked out perfect. Better safe than sorry.

After I installed the Valve body it seems like my kickdown linkage is not pushing the valve in very far. The valve is free and can push in quite a ways but when Valve Body is installed the kickdown linkage don't seem to move it very far when applied from the outside. Maybe a 1/2 inch at the most. Do I have something wrong?

 

[Pennyduke]

Got the Trans installed and I have no leaks and all gears. It shifts really quick into second then has a split second Flare or rev from second to third. I used a TCI 2000 stall converter so I think it feels a little different in first than the stock converter. Should I worry about the Flare? Thank you all for getting me through this first rebuild. I'm very happy so far.