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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey dudes, I'm Chuck, I have a Camaro, but am not biased so don't worry, I won't be bashing... I have a buddy w/ a 1980 Ford Fairmont Futura that we're thinking about making a sleeper street project. It's got a pretty fresh 302 in it, 2.73 gears w/ a C3 tranny... So it's not exactly fast, but there is a lot of potential because the car is very solid as well as the drivetrain. Here's the plans, please tell me what this sounds like...

Motor:
stock bottom end, compression raised to 11.5:1
Heads- Brodix Track 1's
Intake- Edelbrock Victor single plane
carb- Holley Street Avenger 870 cfm
cam- custom grind I came up with on the computer... . (this is seat to seat btw) 550/.565 lift, 278/295 duration, 115.8 lobe center, 55.0 valve overlap.
rocker arms- Comp Cam Pro Magnum full rollers
lifters- Crane solid rollers

Here's another cam I made up. Makes a little more power down low. .550/.565 lift, 263/287 duration, 115.5 lobe center, 44 overlap. This one doesn't make as much power in the 6500-7500 rpm range as the other one, but it makes better torque and hp below that. On Desktop dyno 2k this one makes 516hp @ 6500 rpm and 462 ft lbs @ 5000. The first one makes 566 @ 7500 and 444 ft lbs @ 5500.


Tranny:
We know the C3 won't last long, so what should we put in there? I'm not a Ford person so I don't know what's good? We'd probably run about a 3500 stall...

Rear end:
Assuming the stock rear end is decent we just plan to put in some 3.73's or 4.10's. What rear end came stock in the 1980 Futura's?

How's this all sound? Anything we should change or do differently?

Thanks
Chuck
Here's my car www.barncandles.com/camaro/Chucks.htm
 

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Chuck, welcome to the best Ford hot rod message board ever. As far as your question, the fairmonts are really good cars which to build on. They are fairly light for their size, just the right wheelbase, and very easy to work with. You already have a 302, so the basics apply...good carb and intake combined with a fair compression (9-9.5:1) along with a good set of mustang headers will really wake it up. Also, it might be a good idea to ditch the c3 and go with a c4. I could be mistaken, but I think its a direct bolt in. The Fairmont's front end is based on the Fox mustang, so anything that will fit a mustang will fit a Fairmont. It's most likely got a 7.5 rear end. It will hold up fine until you find some traction to go along with the power. You can find 3.73 or 4.10 gears in many rangers with the same 7.5 rear. If it was me, if you're planning on street driving, I'd go with no lower than 3.55-ish gearing. I'm sure others will add more later.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Well, the basics like headers and exhaust have been done, so we just plan to do a little head/cam job on the motor. I listed all the stuff we plan to do, I'd like to know how it sounds and if we should do anything differently.

Thanks
Chuck
 

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I don't want to rain on your parade but getting well over 500 hp from a naturally aspirated 302 isn't going to be easy.If you were able to do it,it would be a totally unstreetable race car in my opinion.Having said that maybe you don't really need 500 plus horsepower.If you do I would plan on nitrous or swapping in a 351 stroker.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Street manars aren't really a HUGE issue... but we do plan on it being a "street" car. It's just not his primary driver so it's not a big deal. According to Desktop Dyno 2k it makes right at 300 ft lbs or torque at 2k rpm. So it should be more than fine on the street. It's basically just going to be a top end build on the 302 short block. Brodix Track 1 heads, Edelbrock Victor intake, 870 Holley, and this custom cam. It's already got long tube headers and dual exhaust w/ no mufflers. Yes, the motor will have to wind up to make it's power, but I think it should be pretty healthy.

Thanks
Chuck
 

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Well, I would go with a new set of the TFS Hi-ports, Victor Jr.s, AFR 205's or Canfields before I would with the Brodix heads. That Holley Street Avenger aint't going to cut it either. Get a 950cfm Holley HP or an AED 850HO, either should support the horsepower and rpm you want. Oh, a stock bottom end is not going to make 500hp on motor either. Consider a rod/ piston upgrade along with a girdle to support that kind of RPM. I would guess 1 3/4 headers and 3in exhaust a minimum. Seriously, if he wants to build a fun Fairmont, he needs to do a little more Windsor homework. You can have a lot of fun with a stock shortblock, but 7000rpm is most you'll make out of it. What you should do is decide how fast you want the car to be and then pick the best way to get there. Good luck with it, though, it sounds like a really fun project!

Dave
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Ok, well the main thing we need to find out is what the bottom end consists of right now. I think it already might be fairly built when his brother in law had it. So we'll see. It was his brother in laws hot rod... So we're not exactly starting w/ a stock Futura.
I'll keep messing around on Desktop Dyno and see what I come up with. But why don't you like the Brodix heads? Because they're too big, or not very good? What do you suggest being the best 302 head for a car that isn't really going to be all about streetability?

Thanks
Chuck
 

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I dont tihnk the car has a c3 in it, its most likly a c5. The c3 was only used with 4 cylinders and 60° V6 engines. Anyway i would switch it for a c4, c6 or toploader. They could handle the power you want.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Ok, I see a numerical sequence here... so tell me what the C5 is... because if the C4 is good enough, and the C6 is better... does that put the C5 in between?

Thanks
Chuck
 

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here it goes. c4 was first, c6 was next. then the c3 and c5. the c3 is light duty, basicly 80' peice of [email protected](like the 200r4 metric).the c5 is mid duty,and basicly a c4 with a locking torque converter.but not dosn't have the perforamce parts for it like the c4. the c4 is good for i say 700hp or so(hey they use it in PRO 5.0), if built right. the c6 is heavy duty(460, FE, 351 4V), and is more then enough for a street car. Also a well built c4 will make the car run faster then a c6 would, because it light.
 

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A C5 is basicly a C4 (actually has a slightly better case). The C4 mods apply to the C5. 64Tbolt here just got one going. Build your own bad ass c4. http://www.fordmuscle.com/phpBB/viewforum.php?forum=13&113 . Its really not that hard. I did it. There are some guys here who know LOTS about that transmission.

What size headers and exhaust do you have on there?
 

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1. take everything desktop dyno says with a very large grain of salt

2. I would start with a cam profile that has already been ground, dyno'd and tested and possibly tweak it a little instead of just going off into the numbers. to have as much duration as you mentioned with that little of an overlap just doesn't look feasible to me. it may be grindable but it may also run like crap.

3. IF you were to build what you listed up there you would have to run a manual tranny or a big stall and a big stall isn't streetable

4. 11.5 is in the realm of not pump gas

5. Do 80 model street cars require smog tests in your area?

6. I don't remember what else I was going to say, LOL.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
First off, why don't you like Desktop Dyno? Is there something I don't know about it? I think it's a good spec comparison program, but I don't know anyone that's actually compared it's figures to a real dyno so I don't know how accurate it is...
As for the cam, I just think it's interesting to use the Iterator on Desktop dyno for designing a custom cam. And I'm curious to maybe try one on this project to see how good it actually is. But I do aggree about streetability. Maybe if I lowered the max RPM to 6500 instead of 7500 it'd come up with something more streetable.
11.5:1 compression not streetable? Well that'd be w/ aluminum heads. I ran 11.5:1 last year on my Camaro with no problem. The motor I'm building for it right now is going to have around 13:1 compression. Not sure how much octane booster and or alcohol injection I'll have to use to get it to run on pump gas, but it is going to be a street car. There's a few places around here that sell 110 and 120 octane so that's really not an issue. Assuming I don't mind spending 3+ a gallon on gas
But I really think 11.5 should be fine w/ 91-93 octane and some octane booster.
No smogs test at all that I know of in Nebraska.
We thought about putting a manual in the car. So that's an option. We're just looking at all the possibility's for now and then will make a complete package that we feel like will accomplish what we want to accomplish with this car.

Thanks
Chuck
 
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