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Discussion Starter #1
I knew this engine are choked by emission control.
Super low compression etc.
But im looking to get some hp out from them. Just a little bit is good for me.
All stock 133 hp 302 engine with everything stock. Comression side it is perfect at 130 dry on each cylinder.

There are something like edlebrok head+camshaft set for $1900+.Will this kit add some hp to my engine? Im just looking at something like 200hp is enough for me.
Plus what hp can the original C4 transmission handle?
 

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Depends on your budget. Those top end kits will absolutely get you over 200hp, most likely closer to 250-300hp depending on the kit, and camshaft. But you could go with a dual plane intake, and some junkyard gt40 or gt40p heads (difference in spark plug angle) and a camshaft, such as a xe268h, and get close to the same hp for 1/3 of the cost, if you're on a budget. The plus side to the kit is if you rebuild the motor and bump up the compression, or go to a stroker kit some day you won't be suffocating the motor with the heads like you would be with a gt40/p head. Another plus side is the weight factor, aluminum heads weigh a lot less than cast iron heads, and the lighter the car the faster it is. And another is that they're brand new, best to have the valves reground if you go to a gt40/p head, which you can do personally, but would cost a small amount to have done at a shop.

Stock C4 can handle 350hp easily, but you do need to account for the age and wear of your transmission. But you shouldn't have an issue with a head and cam upgrade.
 

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set aside some money for a new ignition system, you're going to want to toss the Duraspark as part of this project.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Depends on your budget. Those top end kits will absolutely get you over 200hp, most likely closer to 250-300hp depending on the kit, and camshaft. But you could go with a dual plane intake, and some junkyard gt40 or gt40p heads (difference in spark plug angle) and a camshaft, such as a xe268h, and get close to the same hp for 1/3 of the cost, if you're on a budget. The plus side to the kit is if you rebuild the motor and bump up the compression, or go to a stroker kit some day you won't be suffocating the motor with the heads like you would be with a gt40/p head. Another plus side is the weight factor, aluminum heads weigh a lot less than cast iron heads, and the lighter the car the faster it is. And another is that they're brand new, best to have the valves reground if you go to a gt40/p head, which you can do personally, but would cost a small amount to have done at a shop.

Stock C4 can handle 350hp easily, but you do need to account for the age and wear of your transmission. But you shouldn't have an issue with a head and cam upgrade.
Uh, The camshaft and head must be match? What will happen if i use stock cam and upgraded head, what will happen?
 

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I don't see what vehicle you intend to put this motor in but recommend doing your exhaust research before getting GT40P heads. The sparkplug angle will limit your options for headers in some vehicles.

Upgrades to the cold side (intake/carb) and cam will provide disappointing returns if you can't get the hot side to flow like you want.

My motor is GT40P and no headers were available for this body style. Many headers for GT40P. A few headers for early Fairlane. No headers for GT40P in early Fairlane.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I don't see what vehicle you intend to put this motor in but recommend doing your exhaust research before getting GT40P heads. The sparkplug angle will limit your options for headers in some vehicles.

Upgrades to the cold side (intake/carb) and cam will provide disappointing returns if you can't get the hot side to flow like you want.

My motor is GT40P and no headers were available for this body style. Many headers for GT40P. A few headers for early Fairlane. No headers for GT40P in early Fairlane.
Luckily i already notice that. with my stock exhaust manifold i dont think the GT40p will work..
 

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don't let that stop you - you've got to get rid of the stock exhaust manifold anyway. :) terrible choke-point, especially if you're talking about upgrading your heads.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
ummm basically, i dunno if the aftermarket exhaust manifold will fit with the original cat pipe. And some thing else, those bolts for exhaust manifold are really rusty. I am really scared to turn them....
And if i use the GT40P heads with the stock cam and stock rocker and stock pushrods, are they gonna work together?? I really dont want to mess with the fron of the engine to take off the condersor/radiator/timing cover all out to install the cam shaft...
 

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Speed costs money how fast do you want to go? That is the question. Something you also might want to consider is the rest of the power train, suspension, brakes, cooling system, exhaust, etc. Is it a 41 year old car and nothing has been do to it, or what changes have already been made? Put more power to a old C-4 and rearend and you'll add up costs real fast. Old cooling systems don't like more HP either. Brakes, how good are they. More HP needs to come to a stop some how.
Then there's the bottom end of the end. Bearings old, timing chain old, oilpump, oil pump driveshaft. Done what you're talking about to a 66 289, C-4 Stang back in 72. C-4 didn't last 2 months before it went south with only 50K on it.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Speed costs money how fast do you want to go? That is the question. Something you also might want to consider is the rest of the power train, suspension, brakes, cooling system, exhaust, etc. Is it a 41 year old car and nothing has been do to it, or what changes have already been made? Put more power to a old C-4 and rearend and you'll add up costs real fast. Old cooling systems don't like more HP either. Brakes, how good are they. More HP needs to come to a stop some how.
Then there's the bottom end of the end. Bearings old, timing chain old, oilpump, oil pump driveshaft. Done what you're talking about to a 66 289, C-4 Stang back in 72. C-4 didn't last 2 months before it went south with only 50K on it.
Thats a good question.
For the car, the engine is never been opened. I just installed a MSD ignition to it week ago, and I can already feel the HP difference. At lease now when I floor it, it actually make some sound.
So first, im not even look into fast, i just want to be safe when driving it on the street, I oftenly get stuck by a big semi and even I floor it, it barely move. Or some other thing, so As i said, im not looking for a 200hp gain, i just want it to achieve 200+hp, because for now, it only have 133hp( maybe even lower cause its pretty old.)
brake system had been freshed up, all new brake pads rotors and drum, and lines. Booster still the same but the brake power is pretty decent. The only problem i have with the brake is the first half of the press didn't really do something.
I think i read somewhere a C4 should be able to handle something like 400+hp? if I only add 50 or maybe 100hp to the original i dont think that will be a problem, even for a 40 year old. I will change the torque converter when get the engine off tho.
Another way, even talking about a new reman C4 is not that pricy, if really need a new C 4 for a 200hp im good with that.
So my goal truly as, a street car(Idle quiet and low), but have plenty of power(133 is just tooooolow for a car in this weight, My Fiat 500 even have 160hp)
 

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Rebuild the C-4 you have now, it fits. Just have them put a few HiPo C-4 parts in it. Clutches, servo, etc. Find a Posi unit for the diff and you probably have 2.73s go to 3.55s. Personally, I work put new rod/main bearings in, oil pump, windage tray and better oilpan, oil pump driveshaft. One of the weak links here when you start building a little power is the rod bolts. Better timing gear set up. Get some roller tip rocker arms.
 

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ummm basically, i dunno if the aftermarket exhaust manifold will fit with the original cat pipe. And some thing else, those bolts for exhaust manifold are really rusty. I am really scared to turn them....
And if i use the GT40P heads with the stock cam and stock rocker and stock pushrods, are they gonna work together?? I really dont want to mess with the fron of the engine to take off the condersor/radiator/timing cover all out to install the cam shaft...
there's no real benefit to increasing the engine's ability to "inhale" if you don't also increase its ability to exhale.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
there's no real benefit to increasing the engine's ability to "inhale" if you don't also increase its ability to exhale.
alright. I will see what i can do do the cat. I think they need to be replaced. they are 40 years old. Plus, i am amazed by those ford thing which they are still working even after 40 years. So consider the modern car maybe go into junk yard after 20 years, im amazed.
 

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You have to remember, 79 was the second year of the Fox platform. 78 Fairmonts and Zephyrs were the new fox system. Might have to dig out some older parts info. I do believe your Fox platform was the same at least up until 92.
 

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Are you required to keep the cats?
I'm in NC - after 35 years, vehicles are no longer required to get the yearly inspection. so...at that point its pretty much "do whatever you want".
the laws vary from state to state. NC is relatively strict in comparison to the midwest, etc.
 

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some have hinted at it...an auto is a system, change 1 thing it effects all the other prts in the system.

I would suggest U take an incremental approach - small (low on the scale) changes 1st. C how U like it, test for an assessment ( drive 1 wk). Then make decisions. I do this as I have low funds.

Another hint I saw above was on application. Every automotive Q has the APPLICATION answ. What is it 4? what is 80% of the use (RMP)? Many do what U hinted at "ignition" (includes initial & total timing) but it looked like U only changed the 'trigger box". DSII (5 parts) is used by the racers today so is a good system. Many simply turn it up (advance the timing 2 - 4*) beyond the stock as that's 1 way they dealt w/pollution then. W/DSII U might experiment w/hotter/colder plugs (do a "plug chop" too) & gap them wider.
B4 an engine tear dwn U may want to try carb or higher ratio (more lift) rocker geometry. W/the 2nd U just take off the VC. I'd say a cam is last. The cam is what U would build yer engine around (if starting frm the beginning - but same Q, 80% of use RPMs & what octane u'd B runnin). Lots more Qs enuff 4 now...
 

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Holy-S**T

It took me over 10mins to read and figure the last post and still not sure some of the abbreviation which often used in SMS messages and I had to google everyone of them. Or maybe it’s your spelling I would suggest a spelling check before you send.

Now back to the subject.

Please don’t get offended:

1. As “mercury4me” asked “I don't see what vehicle…”
2. As “rickyracer1983” mentioned “…your Fox platform….” Please share how the assumption/conclusion you have it’s a Fox since there was no mention other this is a 1979 engine and a C4 trans. You could have a Ford Truck or even place the engine/trans in a Chevy, Chrysler, etc……..?
3. As “cuthrell” Asked “….required to get the yearly inspection” if you need Smogged that will determine the limitation of what can or cannot perform.
4. There was mention about Brakes system but still no mention of the Vehicle.
5. There was mention of “…don’t want to mess with the front of the engine to take off the condenser/radiator/timing cover all out to install the cam shaft...” again still no mention of the Vehicle.

Not trying to be picky or difficult but I need detail to be able to understand the entire story and answer your original request. I do agree with everyone’s posting of possible modifications to increase HP but the modifications will be determine if we knew the answers to the items mentioned.

With my own experience I’ve spent money every pay day on my vehicle which now I thick back “That was a waste of money and time wish I wouldn’t of done that”.

Remember one thing “Turbo and Supercharging” or is it two things?[/QUOTE]
 

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you're going to want to toss the Duraspark as part of this project.
No! There is nothing wrong with Duraspark....However....The aftermarket stuff that is sold "Now" is junk! Yea I know.....your 30yr old MSD runs great.
 
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