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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I've stayed up way too late playing with Dyno200 and Drag2000. According to Dyno2000, the following combination will make a peak hp of [email protected] and a peak torque of 331[email protected]:
-Stock 289 heads (flow #'s taken from this site)
-Stock compression of approx 9.64:1
-Dual plane manifold with 660cfm induction
-Small-tube headers with open exhaust
-Comp Cams Extreme Energy 268 Cam(Intake .509 lift, 224* @.050, Exhaust .512 lift, 230* @.050, 110*LSA)
Does this seem realistic?

Drag2000 says the following combination will run me through the 1/4 in 13.011 at 103.3mph:
-Above engine in a 64 Fairlane (estimated weight of 3400 with 36% on rear wheels and 115" wheelbase)
-T10 4-speed out of a non-HIPO 63 Fairlane, yeilding ratios of 1)2.73, 2)2.04, 3)1.51, 4)1.00.
-3.25:1 rearend
-205/50R15 BFG drag radials with a diameter of 23"
-Launch rpm of 5000
-Shift rpm of 5775
Does this seem realistic? Would this combo hook well enough in the real world to see these low times(Drag2000 says 1.909 60')? My goal is to be just above the 12.99 time that would demand a roll bar.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: 8BBL427 on 5/31/02 4:13pm ]</font>
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Just moving this back to the top of the list. Please give me a hand. I have the phone in one hand, the IRS refund check in the other, and my nose in the Summit catalog. I need an expert opinion or two before I have a UPS truck of parts headed my way.

Thanks.
 

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On 2002-06-01 01:58, 8BBL427 wrote:
Just moving this back to the top of the list. Please give me a hand. I have the phone in one hand, the IRS refund check in the other, and my nose in the Summit catalog. I need an expert opinion or two before I have a UPS truck of parts headed my way.

Thanks.
Cant offer any advice, but I must say that you;ve got a dangerous combination goin on!! (the $$ phone and Summit rag I mean) Im wonderin if I should buy stock in Summit
 

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Sounds realistic to me. I would FOR SURE home port and polish those heads. Also have the block decked and .010 shaved off the heads,acheive zero deck on the piston deck height, Have your crank polished with .002 EXTRA clearance and run a high vol Melling pump and buy the ARP oil pump drive shaft. Order the cam in the 351w firing order that puts the sequential firing back in the block where it can handle it better,match port intake and exhaust, arp rod bolts, Cloyes True Roller timing chain and begin to think about 3:55 or 3:75 gears.
 

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The 1/4 mile numbers sound a little too quick for that mild combo.I would guess it might run a 13.99 with good traction. The 268 cam is a little small. I would go with the XE274 or a 270S solid cam.The firing order doesn't matter and power wise there will be no difference between the 351 or 289 firing order.You don't need a roll bar until 11.99 so you could go for a lot more motor before worring about the roll bar.

_________________
'58 Morris Minor 289 S/S MM
'62 Falcon 351W "Just Falcon Around"

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Just Jim on 6/2/02 7:26am ]</font>
 

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For 3400 pounds to run the quarter in 13 flat takes around 305 horses to the rear wheels or around an estimated 350 or 360 motor horses.

I think the problem where these dyno/drag sim programs fall down is that they don't do a very good job of estimating the difference between flywheel and rear wheel horses.

Go back to your dyno program and keep turning it up until you make around 360 horses and that should run around a 13 flat on an optimum day.

I run mid 12's on NHRA and IHRA tracks with no roll cage. The cage rule hits you at 11.99. All I have is a good seat belt, helmet and a drive shaft loop.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Hottarod on 6/2/02 5:12am ]</font>
 

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The cam is about right. I like the XE268. The heads will be what hold you back. I'm with Hottarod... In reality, you'll be doing well to break into the 13's at all using totally stock, unported heads and drag radials. The heads will be all finished by around 5500 rpm, and camming the engine to spin faster than that will be a mistake. All it will be making at higher rpms is noise, not power. Drag radials and 4-speeds don't mix. Stick shifts need soft sidewalls to absorb the shock of a 'clutch' launch. 5000 rpm launches using drag radials and a stick shift is a fantasy.

You need to do some major work on those heads, or go to the aftermarket... and get a REAL set of slicks. Mount them on a seperate set of rims and save them for 'special' occasions. They will last several years that way. Mickey Thompson 26x8.5 ET Drags, or the ET Street equivalent would be the perfect tire for your car.

I DO like that cam for a 302. It's all you need to run the thing (with good heads) up to around 6400 rpm. Using something bigger for that rpm range will just kill off the midrange.

My unfiltered $0.02


Good Luck!
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Thanks for all the great responses. As to the weight of my car, no I don't really know what it weighs or the weight distribution. I guessed high, figuring that in a worst case scenario my car would be quicker than I planned. (Lowering the weight in my calculations also means I have to admit that I'm not currently making much power. My one trip to the drags resulted in a 16.0 1/4 at 86mph.)

Cam Choice: my original plan was to run the CompCams 270S. Becuase I have shelled out a chunk of change for a power brake booster and dual M/C that I think will prohibit easy valve cover removal, I am opting to go with a hydraulic cam. Becuase I currently have a C4 with stock converter (T10 is in my garage while clutch and linkage are being gathered), I am limited in cam size. According to Dyno2000, the XE268 will make more power than the 270H and not a lot less than the 270S while the XE274 is a tad on the big side for my needs. Dyno2000 seems to make some pretty big assumtions regarding lifter acceleration rates and differences between hydraulic and solid lifters. Is the 270S really much better than the 270H, or is this just based on assumptions built into the software?

Roll Bar: Thanks for setting me straight. Aftermarket heads and/or a small shot of N2O may now be in my future.

Heads: I would love to go with a set of aftermarket heads, but this is currently cost prohibitive. I do plan on buying the K-kit through Comp cams that includes stiffer springs and new retainers/seals etc. This will be installed on the 289 heads that came from my dad's 65 Mustang. These heads were converted to screw-in studs, guide plates and posi-locks and given a 3-angle valve job by my dad in the 70's. I may lightly touch the ports. Another option is to bolt on a set of 1969 351w heads I have sitting on the engine I pulled from a Cougar. I don't want to pour money into reworking stock heads. I think I would be better off saving that dough for aftermarket peices down the road. What do you guys think?

Slicks: P205/50R15 drag radials was my attempt to gain the best of all worlds. I already have a set of chromed reversed wheels with this size street tire that I know will fit the hole. If I step up to a wider tire, I will need to get a new set of wheels with a custom back space, nearly doubling my price. Would you believe I modeled different gear and tire sizes and the car would actually be slower? I think this was due to an increase in wheelspin. Also, swapping to steeper gears and taller slicks would mean needing taller street tires to maintain a decent highway cruising rpm. More money I don't have. (My wife is very supportive, but our third child is less than a week old, so my fun money is quickly being redirected to diapers.) Anybody know where I can get a cheap set of wheels with a deep backspace?

Thanks again for all the great input. Sounds like I need more power via better heads and more traction via real slicks to make my current goal of 13.0
 

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I know what you mean about tight funds... Our third child is six months old right now.


If you've got more time than money, you can get the grinder after those 289 heads. You don't HAVE to spend a ton of money to make a good amount of progress.

The exhaust ports need some MAJOR hogging. Match the port outlet to your gasket of choice, then make the port roof a STRAIGHT, FLAT shot to the back of the port. This involves grinding out the thermactor boss (which is toward the port exit) as well as the 'ski ramp' valve guide boss in the bowl area. Doing this, and opening up the sides of the port, while centering the guide in the port the best you can is a GOOD way to make power with these heads.

You'll want a 1/4" grinder and a few carbide burrs. The grinder can be purchased on EBAY for around $19 (I've got two, they are bluish green in color.) and the burrs are available at a number of places. Hook up a speed control since those burrs won't last at those 25,000rpm grinder speeds. They like a little less than half that speed. You can use a simple 300W dimmer switch. (usually used for lighting) These are cheap, and work just fine.

Hog out the exhaust ports, then follow this article (which includes TONS of pictures)

http://www.sa-motorsports.com/diyport.htm

Good Luck!
 
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