Hey All,
This is going to be a "straight skinny" technical thread concerning the efficacy of the Frantz Oil Cleaner Oil Filtration System as used on Ms. American 3.14159.
To start with, here are the unresponded to posts from another thread:
Gary wrote:
While this is pretty much an accurate synopsis of the situation, there should probably be a much more specific summary of the history of Ms. American's 3.14's (that's the Engine) lubrication history, for it has in some cases varied from the "straight&narrow" path that would have been the "theoretical" ideal.
Will supply that summary as best as it can be remembered.
It MIGHT be efficacious to include Lorrie Van Haul's history also, as HER mighty 225 Slant Six Engine was rebuilt in 1986, and she too has a Frantz Oil Cleaner System,
Her oil has not been changed since NEW oil was put in when the Engine was rebuilt. AND it includes having sat while Lorrie was in her sixteen year long coma.
Wesley wrote:
NO. Whenever the Paper Roll Element is changed, there is a certain amount of oil that "lost". That oil is replaced to bring the oil level on the Dip Stick to the "topped off" mark.
Also, over the years the Hose FROM the Adapter TO the Frantz Canister, and the Hose FROM the Frantz Canister back to the BLOCK have managed to develop a leak of a minute amount of oil at their fittings.
BUT, this is all watched carefully. The oil level is checked before going anywhere because the hood has to be lifted to connect the Quick Disconnect Fitting on the Negative Pole of the Battery. This fitting was installed because there is a "slow" leak of electricity somehwhere in the system, and thus whenever the 3.14 is shut down, the Battery is disconnected. I keep a terry cloth rag between the Battery and the Inner Fender, and when hooking up the Battery to go somewhere, it has just become part of the routine to check the level of the oil on the Dip Stick. If it perchance below the topped off Mark on the Dip Stick, it is noted. And over the amount of time that it takes to get to the Add Mark on the Dip Stick, then a quart of oil gets added.
Also, right after changing the Paper Roll Element, and the Engine is started and the system checked for leaks, when the 3.14 is shut down, and is let to sit. Before the next start up, the oil is checked and due to the oil that has been used to soak up into the NEW Paper Roll, there is an amount of oil needed to bring the Dip Stick up to the topped off mark.
Deb wrote:
Dusty wrote:
Wesley wrote:
BTW, during the latter part of Spring, through the Summer and half way through Autumn, the 3.14 get 50 weight Valvoline Racing Oil. From Autumn through Winter and half way into Spring, the 3.14 gets 10W40 Valvoline Racing Oil.
Upon startup, the 3.14's RPMs are kept at a point where the Oil Pressure Gauge reads no more than 80 PSI. At operating temperature, with a 160 degree thermostat, the 3.14 runs at from 160 to 195 degrees depending on the ambient temperatures. After running at 195, upon parking the Temperature Gauge can indicate as much as 220 degrees, but it goes right back down to 195 as soon as the 3.14 is restarted. Also, on the highway, the Oil Pressure is between 60 and 65 PSI, dropping to as low as 35 PSI while idling.
Alright, here are some specifics about the oil history since 1989. There have been times when the 3,000 miles between Paper Roll Elements have been made in a matter of a week. Trips from her to California and Back being those instances. There have over the past five to eight years been months elapse between Paper Roll Element changes due to not driving Ms. American, or driving her very little. And there was an instance maybe ten years ago when the Canister was not properly locked down (my bad), and some oil was lost due to THAT. It took three quarts to replace what was lost. But other than that, what Gary said in his synopsis of the history of the 3.14's oil changes is pretty much the way that it has gone.
There needs to be made mention of something here also that is a recent development. As you all know we've been doing the Autolite 4100 Installation Caper. And since the middle of November, the 3.14 has spent most of its time running in an attempt to get the 4100 dialed in. We've been through a bunch of wackiness, and I don't know WHY this is, but I've noticed that the color of the Oil on the Dipstick is slightly darker than it usually is, but it is still clear, and looks like NEW oil except for the slightly darker cast.
Am going to change the Paper Roll Element. Acquired the 10W40 Valvoline Racing Oil yesterday. The level on the Dip Stick is showing that it would take a pint to top off the level, and so by the time that the New Paper Roll Element is in place, the 3.14 run to check for leaks, it will take a quart to bring the oil level back up to the topped off mark.
So where do we go from here. Let the test begin.
How much oil does a laboratory need to run the proper test? We should probably start with a sample of the oil as the 3.14 sits right now. Then change the Element, top off the Dip Stick and then obtain another sample. And maybe get a sample from Lorrie's oil also.
Will do whatever is decided.
JC
This is going to be a "straight skinny" technical thread concerning the efficacy of the Frantz Oil Cleaner Oil Filtration System as used on Ms. American 3.14159.
To start with, here are the unresponded to posts from another thread:
Gary wrote:
Hey Gary,
While this is pretty much an accurate synopsis of the situation, there should probably be a much more specific summary of the history of Ms. American's 3.14's (that's the Engine) lubrication history, for it has in some cases varied from the "straight&narrow" path that would have been the "theoretical" ideal.
Will supply that summary as best as it can be remembered.
It MIGHT be efficacious to include Lorrie Van Haul's history also, as HER mighty 225 Slant Six Engine was rebuilt in 1986, and she too has a Frantz Oil Cleaner System,
Her oil has not been changed since NEW oil was put in when the Engine was rebuilt. AND it includes having sat while Lorrie was in her sixteen year long coma.
Wesley wrote:
NO. Whenever the Paper Roll Element is changed, there is a certain amount of oil that "lost". That oil is replaced to bring the oil level on the Dip Stick to the "topped off" mark.
As far as I can discern, the 3.14 doesn't "burn" oil. But this is not to say that there is NOT some oil loss. Have noticed that there is some seepage around where the Frantz Oil Cleaner System Adapter is screwed onto where the "regular" Oil Filter goes. There is always a "drop" of oil on the bottom of the Adapter and after sitting for a while (some amount of days) there is a Oil Spot on the pavement under the Adapter.
Also, over the years the Hose FROM the Adapter TO the Frantz Canister, and the Hose FROM the Frantz Canister back to the BLOCK have managed to develop a leak of a minute amount of oil at their fittings.
BUT, this is all watched carefully. The oil level is checked before going anywhere because the hood has to be lifted to connect the Quick Disconnect Fitting on the Negative Pole of the Battery. This fitting was installed because there is a "slow" leak of electricity somehwhere in the system, and thus whenever the 3.14 is shut down, the Battery is disconnected. I keep a terry cloth rag between the Battery and the Inner Fender, and when hooking up the Battery to go somewhere, it has just become part of the routine to check the level of the oil on the Dip Stick. If it perchance below the topped off Mark on the Dip Stick, it is noted. And over the amount of time that it takes to get to the Add Mark on the Dip Stick, then a quart of oil gets added.
Also, right after changing the Paper Roll Element, and the Engine is started and the system checked for leaks, when the 3.14 is shut down, and is let to sit. Before the next start up, the oil is checked and due to the oil that has been used to soak up into the NEW Paper Roll, there is an amount of oil needed to bring the Dip Stick up to the topped off mark.
Deb wrote:
Not that I recall. There was no oil lost during the rocker adjustments.
Dusty wrote:
Actually, there is no oil lost in the element change. It is done in the morning with the 3.14 cold, having sat overnight. The Oil in the canister would have run back into the Engine. Where there IS a loss of oil is when the NEW Element soaks up as much oil as it holds in suspension. THAT has to be replaced. It is maybe a pint.
That's what we will find out!
Wesley wrote:
Right.
BTW, during the latter part of Spring, through the Summer and half way through Autumn, the 3.14 get 50 weight Valvoline Racing Oil. From Autumn through Winter and half way into Spring, the 3.14 gets 10W40 Valvoline Racing Oil.
Upon startup, the 3.14's RPMs are kept at a point where the Oil Pressure Gauge reads no more than 80 PSI. At operating temperature, with a 160 degree thermostat, the 3.14 runs at from 160 to 195 degrees depending on the ambient temperatures. After running at 195, upon parking the Temperature Gauge can indicate as much as 220 degrees, but it goes right back down to 195 as soon as the 3.14 is restarted. Also, on the highway, the Oil Pressure is between 60 and 65 PSI, dropping to as low as 35 PSI while idling.
Alright, here are some specifics about the oil history since 1989. There have been times when the 3,000 miles between Paper Roll Elements have been made in a matter of a week. Trips from her to California and Back being those instances. There have over the past five to eight years been months elapse between Paper Roll Element changes due to not driving Ms. American, or driving her very little. And there was an instance maybe ten years ago when the Canister was not properly locked down (my bad), and some oil was lost due to THAT. It took three quarts to replace what was lost. But other than that, what Gary said in his synopsis of the history of the 3.14's oil changes is pretty much the way that it has gone.
There needs to be made mention of something here also that is a recent development. As you all know we've been doing the Autolite 4100 Installation Caper. And since the middle of November, the 3.14 has spent most of its time running in an attempt to get the 4100 dialed in. We've been through a bunch of wackiness, and I don't know WHY this is, but I've noticed that the color of the Oil on the Dipstick is slightly darker than it usually is, but it is still clear, and looks like NEW oil except for the slightly darker cast.
Am going to change the Paper Roll Element. Acquired the 10W40 Valvoline Racing Oil yesterday. The level on the Dip Stick is showing that it would take a pint to top off the level, and so by the time that the New Paper Roll Element is in place, the 3.14 run to check for leaks, it will take a quart to bring the oil level back up to the topped off mark.
So where do we go from here. Let the test begin.
How much oil does a laboratory need to run the proper test? We should probably start with a sample of the oil as the 3.14 sits right now. Then change the Element, top off the Dip Stick and then obtain another sample. And maybe get a sample from Lorrie's oil also.
Will do whatever is decided.
JC
